Lion of the Blogosphere

Interview with Elliot’s former high school principal

Here’s a very interesting article.

[Deborah] Smith, the former Independence High School principal, first came into contact with Rodger when she worked as a Los Angeles Unified School District behavioral specialist and Rodger was attending Taft High School in Woodland Hills. Smith helped Rodger — who was identified as a child with Asperberger’s [sic] syndrome and who received support in the school district for it — get into a smaller school after an incident in which he suddenly became “socially frozen” in the hallway shortly after starting at the charter school in Woodland Hills, she said.

“He became panic stricken in a hallway and couldn’t move,” Smith said, noting the incident lasted for at least a few minutes.

Smith, who soon became the principal of Independence High and today holds the post at Daniel Pearl Magnet High School, said she believes that district staff had to call his mother so she could walk him out to the car. Smith said she recalls that he didn’t return to the school after that incident and he was eventually transferred to Independence High after spending some weeks at home.

Smith felt confident about placing him at Independence, she said, because she knew he would not be picked on or bullied, something she felt he was vulnerable to because of his slight stature and “very quiet” persona.

Rodger was “extremely bright,” had near-perfect attendance and mostly got straight A’s in his assignments at Independence, Smith said. But his social awkwardness kept him from engaging with other students, she said.

Many of her students tried to reach out to him, she said, and they would encourage him to join in. But even when he did, she said, he wouldn’t really engage and would only listen.

“For the most part, I hate to say this, he was probably fairly invisible,” she said. “He pretty much stayed by himself. He would come to my office occasionally. Very rarely would he come and sit down and have a conversation with me. When he did, I felt like it was a victory. (It was like) ‘Oh my gosh, he had a conversation with me’… Most of the time, he would answer questions with one word or as minimally as he could.”

So it’s as I suspected (and wrote in my previous post summarizing his autobiography), even though Elliot never mentioned this at all in his autobiography, the adults in Elliot’s life believed that he had Asperger’s Syndrome, although I continue to believe that this was an incorrect diagnosis, and in fact because of this diagnosis he never got any treatment for his real problems of social anxiety.

Did Elliot never mention Asperger’s because he was in denial or ashamed of the diagnosis, or because the adults in his life kept that diagnosis from him?

Symptoms of Asperger’s Syndrome include eccentric or repetitive behaviors, communication difficulties, coordination problems (but in fact he was coordinated enough to be an average level skateboarder when he was younger), and of course obsessive interests in weird things. I don’t consider his interest in World of Warcraft to be an Asperger’s type of obsessive interest. WoW is not really that abnormal, millions of people play it. He had the same videogaming interests as his nerdy friends. It’s a normal nerdy interest and not a weird interest. Also, he quit playing WoW after realizing it was nerdy and not helping him develop.

Written by Lion of the Blogosphere

May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

Posted in Psychology

88 Responses

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  1. “Most of the time, he would answer questions with one word or as minimally as he could.”

    Laconic game. She wanted to ride his wang-bone.

    Vince, the Lionhearted

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  2. Isn’t everything in America that isn’t exceedingly dumb or that doesn’t immediately stimulate some pleasure center considered weird? Didn’t Fussell make this point? For me, I limit weird to interests that are exceptionally passive, escapist driven and don’t assist the individual mature or learn to interact with others. So, for instance, I consider video gaming for anyone over age 17 to be weird though I must concede it does, at times, allow its practitioners to interact with others. However, I’m sure many people would consider reading blogs about Shakespeare or social status to be weird.

    Curle

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • Hey hey, now, that’s what teen-aged virgin weirdos graduate to.

      Men must seek their virile level.

      If a 16-year-old boy who isn’t an innate breeder must play something on Steam in order to procure his masculinity, he’s only doing it because that is all that’s available him in 2014. What do you want him to do…go slay a dragon?

      Socially Extinct

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • Join a band. Do athletics, even if you are bad at it. Wrench on a car. Build something. Train dogs. Take up running. Even the Boy Scouts teaches leadership. Do something that entails some sort of accomplishment for which there might be some skill set transition to the adult world.

        Show you want to become an adult.

        BTW – is it normal these days to avoid doing any activity where you won’t be the best? Seemed to come through in Elliot’s comments re: skateboarding (which to me is OK, it develops coordination).

        Curle

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • Although he was probably too athletically inept for sports, the advice is fine advice that he should have been directed towards some activities like you propose that would have benefited him. That’s why I think the adults in his life failed him. Elliot was too shy to take these initiates on his own.

      • Curle,

        These days, unless you are very good at something, most people will quickly drop out. I have always thought of it as the real lesson from Little League: be an all-star or quit.

        superdestroyer

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • I think a small guy has an advantage in balance sports like skiiing, skateboarding, trick biking, skating…sheesh tall guys suck really.

        Nowadays parents stand back and passively wait for a kid to spontaneously show an interest in something, instead of guiding them and getting them into something active. In a way a most kids really are blank slates and don’t have a clue what they want to do recreationally or with their lives either. At least, give them something to reject in favor something else. E.g. Mom made take piano lessons but I took up guitar instead.

        caroljm36

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • This is a pet list of diversions a psychotherapist would probably recite in order to make a tormented young man forget his problems, not take charge of his presumed insignificance. “Sense of accomplishment” is really just bitch-babble because it is too goal-oriented. Goal-orientation is the antithesis of masculinity.

        Masculinity is exertion and momentum; it is a progressive element. Masculinity offers an oblique, subtle sense of shifting the landscape. For sure, athletics are a wonderful way to rediscover ferocity, which is what today’s young boys need, however it is too often turned into a hollow, superficial competition bolstered by nagging, competitive mothers.

        I was Elliot Rodgers (minus the director father and Chinese mother) in the mid-80s and the shrinks tried to pump me up with anti-depressants and neuroleptics and only after experiencing the terrible side-effects did I rebel against the treatment. Instead, I took up an activity my old-school family MD suggested: weight-lifting. I finally discovered an internalized sense of constructive aggression and purpose. Even though competition with others was the farthest thing from my mind, I found great resolve in my own private accomplishments. I would urge all young men to take up weightlifting. It should be mandatory for all 16-year-old males.

        And maybe they should read this, too.

        http://www.oldtimestrongman.com/strength-articles/iron-henry-rollins

        Socially Extinct

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • Being small doesn’t precludes you from joining sports, it’s more about heart than it is about physical size. When you are small and determined to keep up with the bigger players and boys, it goes a long way in forging mental toughness. Games are poor substitutes for real team sports or sports in general.

        L

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • He was involved with skateboarding. His mother signed him up for lessons and spent a lot of time driving him around to skateboard parks. He liked it for awhile but gave it up after a year or two. He got discouraged because he couldn’t do as many tricks as some other kids his age, no matter how much he practised. He became jealous and angry when he saw other kids doing tricks he couldn’t do (foreshadowing his rage and jealousy to come after puberty hit). He had a competitive and jealous nature.

        When he was older he took some sort of martial arts class for awhile. I think the teacher asked him to leave the class because he got angry and hurt someone–he was vague about exactly what happened.

        Rosenmops

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • “Do something that entails some sort of accomplishment for which there might be some skill set transition to the adult world”

        Yes you are absolutely right. This could have been something as simple as an after school job at a gas station or a grocery store, or volunteering at a Humane Society or a nursing home. Anything where he had to expend some minimal effort, get out into the real world. A church group, the school play. Hell, start with turning in his damn homework.

        McFly

        May 27, 2014 at EDT am

      • liberals say “…because racism”.

        conservatives say “…because socialism”.

        almost every american says “…because crazy people”.

        jorge videla

        May 27, 2014 at EDT am

      • “Being small doesn’t precludes you from joining sports, it’s more about heart than it is about physical size. When you are small and determined to keep up with the bigger players and boys, it goes a long way in forging mental toughness. Games are poor substitutes for real team sports or sports in general.”

        Your motivation in sports is directly linked to your perceived physical ability.

        In my experience, males or females with poor body image (almost always linked to actual poor body) performed very poorly as a rule in school sports.

        Thomas

        May 27, 2014 at EDT am

      • When every single person on the team is better than you, that’s too demotivating, especially for someone like Elliot who had very high Neuroticism and couldn’t deal with that.

    • What do you want him to do…go slay a dragon?

      They should do what the teenage Lion did: Prowl lower Manhattan in search of value transferers and battle them in hand to hand combat.

      The Undiscovered Jew

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • No Average Joe really gave a f*ck about Wall St during the 80s. It wasn’t even an industry worth considering for status climbing back in the day. Just as PUA wasn’t even in its infancy during that time.

        JS

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • Another problem in America is that most young attractive women like men have low brow interests, and you wouldn’t find them in high culture settings except when there is a social function where they parade down the ballroom with their dresses. So if you are weirdo, you’ll be with other male weirdos, 90% of the time. And when I say weird, it’s normal for a philosophy discussion group to take place in Europe, where you find attractive women who take interest in it, unlike the states, where it’s mostly a sausage fest.

      Again, just to remind everyone, Americans are proles, so you can feel good about the people around you.

      JS

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • and the europeans i’ve met to a man/woman say americans are fat and stupid.

        so why aren’t their iq scores much higher?

        jorge videla

        May 27, 2014 at EDT am

      • The measure of IQ is an useless affair. A mere observation and an automatic assumption that certain groups rank lower in intelligence is sufficient, and people are right most of the time.

        The average Spaniard in Madrid is no less smarter than the average Jane/Joe in any big US metro.

        JS

        May 27, 2014 at EDT am

  3. Let’s face it, with so much government coercion in all other areas of life, we need to go to a system of guaranteed minimum sex for young men. Guys can present a certificate that they don’t carry any dangerous bugs, and then blonde girls have to spread.

    mel belli

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  4. Asperger has become the politically correct term for “loser with bad genetics”.

    Seriously. It’s just a polite way of saying that a young man sucks at life and has had no luck in the genetic lottery.

    Society has a habit of inventing euphemisms to cover unpleasant, taboo realities. Moron became intellectually challenged, then special needs, and so on.

    Thomas

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • Sucks that the media (in general) has tarnished and inflated the label of Asperger’s syndrome. Of course, bad social skills and introversion are not sufficient criterion for Asperger’s syndrome.

      Thomas, did you believe once that Asperger’s referred to be a specific

      Society has a habit of inventing euphemisms to cover unpleasant, taboo realities. Moron became intellectually challenged, then special needs, and so on.

      Asperger’s syndrome does not reflect that phenomenon of merely changing the labels for a specific condition. Asperger’s syndrome is a victim of expansion and inclusion.of too many people under its umbrella.

      Latias

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • I never took a psychiatry class in medical school, and I don’t have any psychiatrist friend, so I don’t know if the most popular psychiatric labels out there are just unduly over-applied by psychiatrists who lack a work ethic, or are completely arbitrary and bonkers in themselves.

        Psychiatry has had a habit of communicating very poorly to the general public since it exists, that we can be sure of.

        Thomas

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • Psychiatry has had a habit of communicating very poorly to the general public since it exists, that we can be sure of.

        Psychiatry barely qualifies as a science. As a rule ignore everything they say unless it’s confirmed by neurologists.

        The Undiscovered Jew

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • But, according to former Playboy Playmate, Jenny McCarthy, routine childhood vaccinations cause autism.

        E. Rekshun

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • the medical students who choose psychiatry are the weird ones.

        the ones who choose thoracic surgery are the egomaniacs.

        jorge videla

        May 27, 2014 at EDT am

    • Psychiatry is a trendy profession. Things come and go. Also, like all medicine, it’s insurance driven. You can’t get insurance to pay for treating someone who is a “loser,” so you have to find categories to put them in that are billable. In this sense, my guess (it’s a total guess) is that the rise of Asperger’s has been a boon to the profession because they can now take the ever growing horde of displaced, alienated young boys ruined by feminism and make them billable.

      Also, talk about him being bullied? Is there anywhere a racial component mentioned in his story? A soft target like Rodger would be a blinking beacon for young NAMs to pound on. They can smell fear.

      peterike

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • Nope, he grew up in Encino. Upscale part of the San Fernando Valley.

        Sheila Tone

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • MaryK is right that this guy was aiming too high for women above his league. I think anything else is secondary when it comes to this shooting tragedy.

        JS

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • Psychiatry isn’t “trendy” but it has a history of being politicized.

        Dave Pinsen

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • Psychiatry isn’t “trendy” but it has a history of being politicized.

        There’s very little difference between those two things.

        peterike

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • There’s a charaacter with Asbergers on the NBC show Parenthood. Most of the time he just comes across as obnoxious. But there was one episode which is reminiscent of what this principal says.

      In one episode the parents agree to let the aspie kid go on a field trip, and after some kids make fun of him, he just sits down in the middle of a hotel hallway and refuses to move until his parents drive out to get him.

      Dave Pinsen

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • Emotional meltdowns are considered a symptom of Asperger’s, but they are also symptoms of just having high Neuroticism without being on an “autism spectrum.” Asperger’s was just the trendy and easy diagnosis that allowed Elliot to go to school a public school to get free help for his Aspergers (which he didn’t actually get) and for his parents to be able to blame a “mental illness” rather than their own bad parenting and to be able to give up on their son because you can’t cure autism.

      • Bingo! lets parents off the hook totally. Look at these families closely, I believe you’ll see a lot of distracted “self actualization” or plain old career mania with the parents. The kids know they’re on the back burner.

        caroljm36

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • Bill Gates is an Aspie. I dont think his genetic makeup is inferior.

      bobo

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • There’s no way an aspie could ever run a company (or even be a manager).

        CamelCaseRob

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • CamelCaseRob, correct, Bill Gates is not Aspie.

      • bill gates is an obsessed a-hole. just like jobs. not an aspie.

        from an employee of jobs: “when he said ‘that isn’t shit’ he meant ‘that’s awesome’.”

        the “secret” of making in corporate america is HARD DRIVE.

        jorge videla

        May 27, 2014 at EDT am

  5. It would seem that the overall message from Elliot’s rampage is that society at large failed in two ways that caused Elliot’s breakdown and the way in which his breakdown ultimately manifested itself.

    1) valuing transient pleasure over longer-term goals that advance society: slightly-above-average IQ Elliot was inculcated with such values (Lion, the main takeaway I have from reading your blog over the years is that a lack of future-time orientation, and in particular people with a lack of future-time orientation, is responsible for many of society’s ills)

    2) cruelty toward the innocent (first toward Elliot; later perpetrated by Elliot)

    anon

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • I’d give Elliot an IQ of 110 or perhaps 120 if I am being generous. There doesn’t seem to be anything inconsistent with an assessed IQ of 110. It would allow him to be “very bright” at a continuation school.

      Latias

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • I agree that being tagged as “very bright” at a continuation school is a lot different than being “very bright” at Stuyvesant High School.

        I give him an IQ of 115 rather than 110 because he wrote a pretty good autobiography all by himself, although it’s no Angela’s Ashes or Dreams from My Father.

      • i felt like his memoir pointed to an IQ closer to 145. to anyone who would say its the kind of document you could expect from a nominally bright kid i don’t think they’re really seeing it properly. if they attempted a similarly styled autobiography i think they could be finding that his is a lot more impressive than it first seemed. he didn’t really lose the narrative at any points. his ability to recall his childhood so vividly, each birthday, each vacation, all his friend and their names, and to keep everything chronologically in line, to keep it all be in the same voice, so the earlier years doesn’t seem more cloudy than the later ones, so it flows as well as it does, is astounding in its own way. on top of that it is very well written. if he didn’t have an IQ that would be placing him in the highly gifted range then he’s a special talent for writing. it would take someone with a lot of patience and high creativity to put the narrative together as he did. he did read voraciously. he had the stints in the bookstores where he’d read books all day on dense subjects. he read the song of fire and ice series from start to end. his mom told him he’s a talented writer so she’d somehow had indication of that (when he thought he had no talents). i don’t see why you couldn’t add very smart to his profile too. with his other issues i don’t think there would be a great contradiction between that and the ways he thought and acted. im pretty sure only one out of some hundreds of kids would be able to pull off an autobiography like his, whatever the incentives you gave them write one were. he’s at least intellectually unusual or interesting even if its not going to put him in a special category for it. i wouldn’t over look that.

        emma goldman

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • on top of that it is very well written.

        but will be described, if it hasn’t already been, as “rambling” and “incoherent”.

        jorge videla

        May 27, 2014 at EDT am

  6. I agree the oddest and saddest part of his memoir his relationship with Jazz. I am surprised you didn’t mention the part where he claims he saved Jazz from drowning. Did he imagine this or did it really happen? He seemed truly freaked out about the prospect of losing his baby brother but then five years later he is plotting to kill him? Doesn’t add up. I keep wondering if he did take psychiatric drugs for a while before refusing to continue taking them, but not before they had permanently screwed up his brain.

    Juan DaShawn Arafat, MSNBC commentator

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • I believe that he did save Jazz from drowning. But that was before he began planning to kill his enemies.

      The drowning story indicates to me that Elliot did have empathy for others, and his life at that time could have been pointed in a much better direction, but the adults in his life failed him.

  7. http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2014/05/ucsb-shooters-parents-tried-to-stop-him.html

    Article says he was in therapy nearly every day of high school. Yet, he was reserved to a daunting degree.

    OK, so what happened in therapy then? He was mighty communicative in his videos.

    Curle

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  8. Interestingly, at least two of the people who reviewed his father’s 2009 documentary called it a “vanity” project.

    Lisa Schwartzbaum’s review in Entertainment Weekly:

    EW’s Grade: D

    British commercial photographer Peter Rodger took his camera — and a crew to document him using his camera — around the world like a well-connected dilettante, asking people the uselessly vague question ”What is God?” There’s no explanation in Oh My God? of how Rodger selected his interviewees: Why was he on the set of Australia, getting spiritual insights from Hugh Jackman? Or on the doorsteps of any of the random respondents who opine (when they weren’t wandering off into unrelated commentary about conflict in the Middle East)? The answers he strings together are babble in this superficial vanity documentary. Nice shots of awesome, God-approved scenery, though.

    http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20319041,00.html

    Lou Lumenick’s review in the New York Post:

    Have you ever wondered what Hugh Jackman and his “Australia” director, Baz Luhrmann, think of God and religion? How about Seal? Ringo Starr? David Copperfield?
    No, me neither.
    “God is an unexplainable concept you can’t put into words,” says Jackman. But that doesn’t stop “renowned commercial director and photographer” (as the press notes put it) Peter Rodger from traveling around the world collecting incoherent theories from celebrities and others.
    There are also frequent on-camera sermonettes about man’s inhumanity to man from the director himself, who is no Bill Maher (“Religulous”), to put it mildly.
    Hearing snoring from behind me at a screening the other day, I looked around and noticed four people had dozed off during the prettily photographed, boring vanity project that is “Oh My God?”

    http://nypost.com/2009/11/13/oh-my-god/

    Akira Kurosawa

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • Hearing snoring from behind me at a screening the other day, I looked around and noticed four people had dozed off during the prettily photographed, boring vanity project that is “Oh My God?”

      There’s the answer to “but where were the adults”? The ‘adults’ are as crazy as Elliot.

      The Undiscovered Jew

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • omigod, sounds like just another phony Hollywood grant hustler.

      caroljm36

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • Elliot’s father comes across as a jackass. He didn’t get grants to make the documentary, he invested his own money–pretty much all his money. After the thing failed to make money (as it predictably did) he had to move to a smaller house and cut back on his child support payments.

      Rosenmops

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  9. Thank you for blogging about this. I don’t think I’ve read useful comments anywhere else.

    albert magnus

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  10. …erections upon seeing beautiful girls…

    erections…tee hee…

    E. Rekshun

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • PLUNGING ERECTIONS

      Samson J.

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  11. This account of the way Elliot stopped attending Taft differs a bit from his own account. Elliot wrote that he refused to get out of the car at the start of his third week at Taft and had a big melt down. His mother didn’t make him go in.

    Perhaps both incidents occurred and his mother tried to make him go back after the incident where he froze in the hallway.

    Rosenmops

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  12. suddenly became “socially frozen”…

    sic is right. SICK is best.

    asperger’s is a developmental disorder. it is never something one “comes down with”. let alone suddenly.

    jorge videla

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  13. …Many of her students tried to reach out to him, she said…

    total bullshit. professional educators are the most numerous legal criminals in american.

    jorge videla

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • Many teachers, including many female teachers, have sex w/ their underage students.

      E. Rekshun

      May 27, 2014 at EDT am

      • it seems it’s mostly female teachers.

        but this doesn’t mean teachers are depraved.

        it’s just another example of how artificial social expectations are.

        i guess a female teacher around some teenage “hunk” all day has thoughts similar to a male teacher around some knock-out.

        it’s human nature.

        jorge videla

        May 27, 2014 at EDT pm

  14. “asperger’s” has come to mean “socially inept”.

    it has come to mean this for obvious ideological and just-world-phenomenon reasons.

    and for business reasons. “uhhh your kid has asperger’s now f—ing pay me!”

    and because most parents today are irresponsible me-generation penises.

    and because even the diagnosed want to be “special”.

    if you really had asperger’s you wouldn’t feel special.

    jorge videla

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  15. This kid had everything I aspire to give my own boys. His parents seem within normal limits of decent parenting, and also had an interesting life with lots of helpful connections. Yet, this happens. It’s depressing. I don’t know what I’d have done that they didn’t.

    Sheila Tone

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  16. That part about freezing in the hallway is way beyond mere eccentricity. It sounds as if there was something really wrong with him.

    Peter

    ironrailsironweights

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • Panic attack. A symptom of high N.

      • hardly. again that trust in psychobabble.

        panic attacks are not “nervous breakdowns”. they are physical.

        i’ve had them over the course of a three days once. IN MY SLEEP! the cause: taking my dog’s clonidine!

        it can also be caused by low blood sugar and alcohol withdrawal.

        it doesn’t feel like being “super nervous”. it feels EXACTLY like a HEART ATTACK. the only difference is you have no trouble breathing.

        i woke up and my heart was pounding like i’d just run the 400m. my systolic bp was > 140 in bed. i had an overwhelming sense i was about to die. i was soaked in sweat.

        jorge videla

        May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • Wait, what? Your dog was prescribed clonodine? And you swiped some from his stash?

        Sheila Tone

        May 27, 2014 at EDT am

      • i had asked my gp for something i could take to “calm my nerves” on occasion. not every day.

        he prescribed clonidine for me.

        clonidine withdrawal can kill. just like withdrawal from alcohol.

        i ran out and took some of my dog’s.

        “aren’t they identical?” i thought.

        well, maybe not. my dog’s clonidine may have been released more rapidly. it may have had a different “formulation”.

        jorge videla

        May 27, 2014 at EDT pm

      • my dog is another story about psychiatry. i had a dog shrink examine him. there are dog shrinks believe it or not. she prescribed him prozac and then clonidine. and if that didn’t work she was going to prescribe an anti-psychotic.

        he’d had at least three owners before me.

        he went nuts whenever he encountered another dog. and by nuts i mean he would bight me. one day there was blood running down my leg. it was gruesome.

        then one day in the park the leash slipped from my hand. i thought, “this is going to be a law suit.”

        what happened? NOTHING.

        THE WHOLE F—ING PROBLEM WAS THE LEASH!

        so i took him to a dog park…and…NO PROBLEM!

        i wouldn’t be surprised if elliot rodger’s rampage could have been prevented if he’d only been let off the leash.

        jorge videla

        May 27, 2014 at EDT pm

    • there was only one kid in my school who might have had something like asperger’s wrong with him. he was very good at math but a rotten chess player.

      he walked the halls touching the wall the whole time. but he had one friend.

      in fact, that friend was the brother of a great beauty and was killed in a skiing accident at 24. c’est la vie.

      jorge videla

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

      • Millions of people have OCD or OCD-like traits. Writing or reading blogs is OCD too.

        MyTwoCents

        May 27, 2014 at EDT pm

  17. plunging

    Plunging

    PLUNGING

    PLUNGING!!!!!

    Hark! Hear the plunging!
    Her slippery vagina!
    BETA RAGE IGNITETH!

    Samson J.

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  18. such crazy deeds must be explained as the result of crazy individuals. but for entirely psycho-social reasons.

    jorge videla

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • and of course the explanation that “it was just some crazy” ignores the question “why are there such crazies?”

      the hereditists have an explanation. somehow by a miracle genes cause some people to be crazy.

      jorge videla

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  19. and if destructure is interested, my only diagnosis so far has been “being an a-hole”. i was “the class clown” and when i thought so i told my teachers they were idiots.

    it has occured to me, “maybe life doesn’t suck. maybe if i just take a pill…”

    so i scheduled an appointment with a psychiatrist.

    he told me this:

    “you’re a cynic with a capital C. you’re at least two standard deviations from the norm in negativity.”

    but, like hegel, i believe in “the power of the negative”.

    jorge videla

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • “you’re a cynic with a capital C. you’re at least two standard deviations from the norm in negativity.”

      god bless you, Jorge.

      You are just like me! Anyone who knows me would say this about me. I wish someone would actually say that to me; I’d take it as a complement. I don’t ever plan to remove my negatively, unless something spectacular happens to the world.

      Latias

      May 27, 2014 at EDT pm

  20. he could have just watched The Tao of Steve.

    all the game bs i learned in the 8th grade.

    typical of me i called one of the pretty girls a stuck up b—-.

    a day later she was whispering in my ear. and it wasn’t a joke.

    men. women. whatever.

    people MOST want what they can’t have.

    jorge videla

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

    • “people MOST want what they can’t have.” Or perhaps women love a challenge.

      I had nearly the same experience, but with a college gal I barely knew. Called her out on some shitty behavior (it was deserved) and a day later she was all over me.

      Curle

      May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  21. Lion,

    You need to do a post focusing on all of the things you think his parents should have done and why you think they would have made a difference when everything that the parents actually tried appears to have failed.

    Howie Stern

    May 26, 2014 at EDT pm

  22. an example from tobias schneebaum, my gay jewish hero, of how utterly f—ed up civilization is…

    in the peruvian amazon was an ethnically spanish priest. this priest had a dwarf hunchback assistant. together they dispensed medicine to the natives. what else are ya gonna do if you’re a dwarf hunchback?

    well, according to schneebaum one of the native women basically approached the hunchback…propositioned him.

    psychiatry will keep growing inexorably in shitty countries like the us and the uk. the ultimate cause of mental illness will be ignored.

    jorge videla

    May 27, 2014 at EDT am

  23. The NY Post interviews Monette Moio’s father: http://nyp.st/TNJqEY

    Dave Pinsen

    May 27, 2014 at EDT am

  24. Aspergers is the ADD of the 2010s. Remember when many people had ADD in the 2000s?

    bobo

    May 27, 2014 at EDT am

  25. Lion, it’s a little tiring to have to watch you discover and give yourself a quick wiki education on clinical concepts like “autism” and “neuroticism”, then start typing as if you had a really good handle on these things (which you quite obviously don’t). It’s laughable, really. Your sense of reason leads you all over wrong territory.

    For example: “I don’t consider his interest in World of Warcraft to be an Asperger’s type of obsessive interest. WoW is not really that abnormal, millions of people play it.”

    The thought that the popularity/familiarity of a video game would preclude people with Asperger’s from developing an obsession with it, or that such an obsession would not suggest Asperger’s for the same reason, is laughable. It implies the type of profound misunderstanding that we often find so entertaining/charming in children (not so much in adults).

    If you approached a competent clinician and said, in a confident tone, “I think that kid obviously didn’t have Asperger’s. Rather, he had high neuroticism”–they would laugh. Maybe not right then, but certainly later.

    It’s sad, because there’s a huge, interesting discussion to be had about the relationship between autism and HBD, social class, mate competition, etc. You’re obviously interested in autism and mental health in general, so wouldn’t this be a great place to actually HAVE that conversation? Unfortunately, your (clearly emotional) need to have things figured out is working against that.

    RBGEORGE

    May 27, 2014 at EDT am

    • Then the clinical technicians are morons and just stealing people’s money. Which seems to be the case.

      Asperger’s is extreme male behavior, systematizing, poor communications skills (but Elliott wrote a very good autobiography), obsessive solitary interests (WoW is a group-game not a solitary game and he played it with his nerdy friends), social cluelessness (of which Elliott demonstrates the very opposite).

      As a pyschiatrist said elsewhere, he said he never had an Aspie patient who had envy and bitterness and anger like Elliott had.

  26. This doesn’t sound like Asperger’s. People with Asperger’s Syndrome typically like to talk. He was more likely profoundly shy (Schizoid Personality disorder).

    Coemgen

    May 27, 2014 at EDT pm

    • A person with Asperger’s syndrome willingness to talk is related to his/her self-confidence and interest in the subject. We often do not like small talk.

      I was actually really shy until I graduate college and I gained a little more confidence in my intellectual abilities. I know how to improvise a few ripostes if someone puts me down and I can defend my intellectual positions well. Often, I am not averse to challenging others, but this does not work well where the means of communication is oral.

      For instance, I remember talking to someone on Friday (just before the killing spree) about the ethics of preemptively aborting those with autism (and my sentiments and thoughts about that), and she asked how did I know it was highly heritable (although she likely did not know what that term technically means). I said that in general there were many studies showing that autism is highly heritable. Somehow, the discussion went to Down Syndrome, and she mentioned in passing that there was some “inherited” form of Down syndrome. I just said that by definition Down syndrome patients have an extra 21st chromosome (or the material contained in the 21st chromosome), and it could potentially be inherited from a parent with a translocated 21st chromosome, and that could create the aneuploidy. Apparently, she did not know what translocation and aneuploidy meant,

      Latias

      May 27, 2014 at EDT pm

      • Many people are highly educated and intelligent, but are not diagnosed with Aspie, do not like small talk either. Academics come to mind!

        JS

        May 27, 2014 at EDT pm

    • Profound shyness is more indicative of avoidant personality disorder. People with avoidant personality disorder want social relationships but are socially inhibited and feel themselves to be poor at social interaction so that they avoid it. Schizoids aren’t shy. They are uninterested in relationships and are very cold.

      nebbish

      May 27, 2014 at EDT pm

      • It’s not quite as you say. Schizoids lack a “socialization gene.” We do not “fit” with normally social people and they do not feel comfortable around Schizoids. Our preferred social milieu is working in an environment with other Schizoids. Elliot did not understand this, It appears that instead, he blamed others for his own idiosyncrasies.

        Coemgen

        June 1, 2014 at EDT pm


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