Lion of the Blogosphere

Police shootings NOT biased against blacks, according to NY Times!

In the NY Times of all places, reporting on a study by black Harvard professor Roland G. Fryer Jr., in the Upshot column:

To answer this question, Mr. Fryer focused on one city, Houston. The Police Department there allowed the researchers to look at reports not only for shootings but also for arrests when lethal force might have been justified. Mr. Fryer defined this group to include suspects the police charged with serious offenses like attempting to murder an officer, or evading or resisting arrest. He also considered suspects shocked with Tasers.

And in the arena of “shoot” or “don’t shoot,” Mr. Fryer found that, in tense situations, officers in Houston were about 20 percent less likely to shoot a suspect if the suspect was black. This estimate was not very precise, and firmer conclusions would require more data. But, in a variety of models that controlled for different factors and used different definitions of tense situations, Mr. Fryer found that blacks were either less likely to be shot or there was no difference between blacks and whites.

I guess this can be reported in the NY Times because Fyer’s research also discovered that police are moderately more likely to use non-lethal force when dealing with blacks. For example, in a stop by police in New York City, blacks are 16% more likely to be handcuffed, 18% more likely to be pushed to the ground, etc. Those in the HBD community are probably not surprised at all by such disparities considering that HBDers strongly suspect that blacks are more likely to be hostile with police and less cooperative than whites. But an 18% difference isn’t really all that big of a disparity. Liberals and Black Lives Matters people imagine it to many times greater than that.

Written by Lion of the Blogosphere

July 11, 2016 at 9:22 am

Posted in Crime, Economics

54 Responses

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  1. Philando Castile, the young man who was shot in Minnesota after telling an officer he had a concealed carry permit and a gun, was stopped by police 52 times in the last 14 years. He was mostly charged with driving without proof of insurance and driving with a revoked divers license. Being charged with those offenses indicates he was not stopped for actual traffic violations, like speeding or running a light. He was stopped because the officer thought he or his vehicle looked suspicious.

    The last time I was stopped for a broken tail light, the officer did not even ask me for my drivers license. He just asked me to get it fixed.

    Mike CA

    July 11, 2016 at 10:50 am

    • “Being charged with those offenses indicates he was not stopped for actual traffic violations, like speeding or running a light. He was stopped because the officer thought he or his vehicle looked suspicious.”

      Not necessarily. Police in many places have cameras that scan license plates and will alert them if you are listed as having a revoked license, missing insurance, overdue registration, etc.


      July 11, 2016 at 12:15 pm

    • There’s a lot of evidence that Philando Castile belonged to a Crips subgang called the Tycoons, which trafficked in underage prostitutes. No one in the media is reporting this, not even on the right.


      July 11, 2016 at 1:16 pm

    • Cops can run your license plate and tell whether the car is insured; they don’t have to pull you over first. They can also tell if the owner of the car doesn’t have a valid license, though that assumes the person they pull over is the owner of the car.


      July 11, 2016 at 5:29 pm

    • This is what happens when you get your news from the MSM, who apparently got all of their information from the suspect’s girlfriend. Castile was pulled over because he matched the description for a robbery.

      Mike Street Station

      July 11, 2016 at 5:45 pm

      • I saw the reports that he was pulled over because he “matched the description for robbery suspects” this time. The robbery suspects were apparently 2 black men. Castile’s passengers were a black woman and a child. Perhaps Castile looked superficially similar to one of the robbery descriptions, but the other occupants of the car did not. So maybe the officer only saw Castile, and decided to stop him because he thought he looked similar to the description. Once he saw the woman and child in the car, he should have relaxed.

        Fundamentally though, that is irrelevant. We don’t have video of the actual shooting. So the police officer can make up whatever excuse he wants for the shooting. His lawyer is now claiming he shot Castile because of his gun.

        Take a look at this video of another incident:

        Black man is stopped for a seat belt violation in a gas station. As he is climbing out of his pickup truck the officer asks for his license and registration. The black man turns around to get them from the truck and the officer shoots him in the leg several times.

        Now this officer was fired because of this dash cam video of what really happened. The officer was trying to claim that the black man was diving back into his truck, but it is obvious from the video that is not true. The black man also made a full recovery from his wounds, thankfully.

        Some police officers have an unreasonable fear of young black men. It is probably only a small percentage of all police officers, but in tense situation it can cause them resort to lethal force without any justification.


        July 11, 2016 at 10:17 pm

      • It’s basically a tautology to say that at least some police officers have an irrational fear of young black men but that video in no way proves that is what caused that cop to do what he did.

        And like I said 30% of the people killed by police are black and 40% of the people killing police are black. That strongly suggests that overall cops are not as afraid of blacks as they ought to be.


        July 12, 2016 at 1:34 am

      • mikeca,

        Think about that. Cop was simply fired for putting bullets in a civilian. And that was only because he was a bad shot. Cops are trained for center-mass shooting, no wouldning. Cop should’ve been charged with attempted murder, or something similar without intent.


        July 12, 2016 at 11:41 am

    • Just be happy your not a violent, stupid black person.


      July 11, 2016 at 9:12 pm

      • Yeah but the whole point of the BLM movement is to make the advantages that gives you as insignificant as possible.


        July 12, 2016 at 1:48 am

    • More than one person can be at fault here.

      No matter who you are, when you are pulled over, you should cooperate with the police (at least as long as the police in the US behave like US police and not Mexican police). Cooperation that includes keeping your hands on the wheel unless asked to reach for something.

      And if you’re a cop, just because the guy you stopped has expired plates, a revoked license and suspected gang affiliations is not an excuse to open fire. As an officer of the law, you have great authority, and it comes with certain expectations (like not having an itchy trigger finger).

      Since the film doesn’t pick up until after the shooting, we will likely never know what really happened. But it’s entirely possible they are all right (and thus, all wrong). Consider the following scenario, cop walks up to the car, starts asking for license and registration, as Castile is moving to comply, his GF mentions concealed carry license and gun (or was it Castile), cop yells for Castile to stop moving, Castile, confused by the conflicting orders, doesn’t comply, officer itchy finger blasts away. Or not a terribly different situation, but after Castile’s weapon is mentioned he moves to show the weapon, thinking he is acting in good faith to diffuse the situation, officer yells, and starts shooting (potentially justifiably). Or maybe Castile just acts like a raging dickwad, as we’ve seen on about fifty billion dashcam videos on COPS, and pays the price when he doesn’t comply with the officer’s orders. Who knows, all are plausible, but we are lacking evidence. There are a lot more (numerically) idiots of every race who act like belligerent turds when the cops show, but there are still some wannabe Stasi on every police force.

      Some Guy

      July 11, 2016 at 10:54 pm

  2. Cops use more force against blacks because they have more priors on their record, and are more aggressive in their interactions with police.


    July 11, 2016 at 11:12 am

  3. HBD or not, but liberal hypocrisy is abound. On the ground, liberal cities are gradually pushing blacks further away from civilization, where Hispanics are being replaced and used as a firewall to keep them at bay. blacks have been lamenting that public housing now takes in the majority of residents, who hablo espanol, despite understanding english.

    The only resolution to America social ills, which is magnanimous and utmost serious, is to bring back segregation and the secession movements of states.

    We already have the expensive liberal centers doing it in front of us. Gentrification of major urban areas leading to high priced real estate, is a way to secede from undesirables. Again, blacks are being pushed out in favor of Hispanics, to suit a multicultural narrative in these centers.

    Remember this: Staten Island guidos once wanted to secede from the bobo snobs and their riff raff in Manhattan during the 1980s!


    July 11, 2016 at 11:27 am

  4. Been wondering, and this is the internet equivalent of thinking out loud here:

    On some level, is BLM a divide-and-conquer movement? Sure, the members, and even most of the leadership, are probably stupid enough to believe the rhetoric but someone, somewhere is cackling at how the movement is ensuring the never ending militarization of the police.

    Plenty of non-black Americans, including a large number of whites, don’t like the police. A movement solely dedicated to cracking down on that (as in, it’s a one trick pony and whatever you believe outside of that, you leave out of the movement) could be very, very successful. How to stop that happening? Repeatedly tell everyone it’s a black problem. Ad nauseam. So the blacks get proprietary, even of the concept of having problems with the police, and everyone else just walks away.


    July 11, 2016 at 11:38 am

    • Some people that don’t like the police dislike them for the opposite reasons as BLM


      July 11, 2016 at 12:25 pm

    • It’s a religious movement.


      July 11, 2016 at 3:21 pm

    • BLM is generally being pushed by two groups — black racists like the New Black Panthers and white radicals like Soros. There’s even a money trail from Soros to groups of radical agitators going back to Ferguson and Baltimore and even the anti-Trump protesters.


      July 11, 2016 at 5:00 pm

    • BLM is a Soros funded AstroTurf movement.

      It’s purpose is to provoke anger and divide the country in an election year where Soros’ candidate is running.

      Soros funded anti-cop demonstrations that preceded regime changes in Malaysia, Tunisia/Egypt, and in the Ukraine. So, this is not unprecedented. Actions are running exactly to script so far.

      Black crime is a real problem. Militarized police is a real problem. BLM is not a real movement that sincerely represents the people marching in its rallies. BLM only exists to sow chaos.


      July 11, 2016 at 6:43 pm

      • BLM isn’t entirely astroturf. White radicals may be inciting and organizing blacks for their own political agenda. But it’s not like those black racists didn’t already exist along with their own agenda.


        July 11, 2016 at 8:01 pm

      • Maybe the administration and funding comes from outside but there is and has been for a long time a lot of anti cop sentiment among underclass blacks.


        July 11, 2016 at 9:29 pm

    • George Soros has donated millions to BLM. So have other wealthy people and companies.


      July 12, 2016 at 8:31 pm

  5. It’s all beside the point. BLM doesn’t want equality of treatment. The demand is exemption from law for blacks. Blacks define “oppression” as having to follow white rules. People just can’t get this.


    July 11, 2016 at 11:40 am

    • Yes, exactly, but the real problem is that the PRESIDENT is aiding and abetting this.

      Look – if the President really had guts, he would address the nation and say that police shootings of any suspect is terrible, but that blacks get shot by the cops in larger proportion to their numbers in society because they commit a disproportionate share of the crime. (Fryer’s finding are interesting but I am thinking of the Rubinstein report, THE COLOR OF CRIME.) He would cop a lot of shit, but he would be courageous, and he would kick this religious hysteria movement in the guts, from which it would never survive.

      He won’t do that. He is an active aider and abettor to arson, IMO.

      The BLM movement is simply a religious movement, with martyrs and dogma and a belief system.

      I believe that the active instigators of the cult are black women, like the one above. She is not lying. She really, really believes that the cops are out to get “her brothers.”

      Michelle Obama said something like that once on 60 Minutes before Obama was elected. Do you remember? She said a black man could get shot just walking to the gas station by….who? A white assailant. That was the implication.

      This is what they believe, in all honesty – that whites are simply out to get them, hunt them down, kill them. The fact that this is absurd and belied by the facts is irrelevant. The truth doesn’t make a damn bit of difference. Only the President can tame this tiger, and he won’t.

      Does he want this country to go down in flames?


      July 11, 2016 at 10:13 pm

      • “The BLM movement is simply a religious movement, with martyrs and dogma and a belief system.”

        Anarchism, communism, socialism and liberalism all have religious components. Basically any political system that is unwilling to examine its core beliefs or admit to failed policies is similar to a religion.

        “Does he want this country to go down in flames?”

        Obama is a radical who stated openly that he wanted to “fundamentally transform” America. He has pursued policies to achieve this end and he’s been pretty successful. I don’t believe that he wants large-scale violence, but he might be OK with some righteous outrage here and there. I think someone like Soros is more comfortable with violence.

        Lewis Medlock

        July 12, 2016 at 11:59 am

  6. Its been known for a while that 30% of the people killed by police are black and 40% of the people killing police are black. And since 50% of of all murders are committed by blacks (and an even higher percentage of murders most similar to police killing) that’s also very strong evidence that blacks are under policed.

    Now what I’d love to see is similar numbers for non lethal things being done by the police versus being done to the police e.g what percentage of people handcuffed by the police are black and what percentage of people running away from the police are black. It is entirely possible that things skew one way for lethal force and another way for nonlethal but it seems unlikely.

    Similar situations account for gender, age, police precinct, the reason for the stop, whether the stop was indoors or outdoors, the time of day, whether the stop took place in a high-crime area or during a high-crime time, whether the officer was in uniform, the type of identification provided, and whether others were stopped at the same time.

    That would work if you were only studying the first thing the police did and you accept that race is never something that the police should let influence their behavior. Everything after the police’s first move is going to be heavily influenced by the person’s reaction to the police. It’s also completely contradicted by the big print part that says “That gap, adjusted for suspect behavior and other factors”

    Moreover, the results do not mean that the general public’s perception of racism in policing is misguided. Lethal uses of force are exceedingly rare. There were 1.6 million arrests in Houston in the years Mr. Fryer studied. Officers fired their weapons 507 times. What is far more common are nonlethal uses of force.

    Gotta love this paragraph. Now police shootings are basically irrelevant. I mean they’re so last week.


    July 11, 2016 at 12:22 pm

  7. I think the problem with this sort of racial analysis is that it misses the point. The point is not that police officers are shooting black people because they are black people. The point is that police officers are shooting blacks because they are scared and angry. Their training is focused on “controlling the situation” and “officer safety” to the detriment of the public with which they interact. It is this increased militarization and unaccountability for shooting deaths that are the problem, not the racial breakdown of victims.

    The impression that is being given is that police are engaging in brutal tactics because they are working hard to protect the general public from blacks. This is, most likely, false. Even heavily white areas have this roided up, militarized police.

    None of this bodes well.


    July 11, 2016 at 1:32 pm

    • This is the intelligent critique of the police: that they’re just too rude and too violent overall.


      July 11, 2016 at 9:25 pm

    • Where are these heavily roided up, militarized police? I’m asking sincerely, not trolling. In NYC the cops look pretty normal. They carry Sigs & Glocks but they are always holstered and most of the time I see them they look very unworried. Lots of women and Asians now on the force. No roids. Of course when I see them they are patrolling Manhattan.


      July 11, 2016 at 10:28 pm

      • NYC cops are less roided up and militarized than in most places.

      • A lot of the really inappropriate militarization has to do with drug raids, especially no-knock early dawn ones.


        July 12, 2016 at 1:28 am

      • Large urban area cops have de-policed. You see those sitting in a Starbucks. Women and Asians on the force probably contribute greatly to shootings since these are skittish, small statured people.


        July 12, 2016 at 4:00 am

      • Female cops tend to be fat Black scowling Lesbians. When I was arrested for marijuana-possession in Maryland years ago, the only cop that was unpleasant to me was a scowling Lesbian — neither fat nor Black, though. New York City cops in general are more and more likely to be Blacks and PuertoRicans/Dominicans of apparently subnormal intelligence who spend a lot of time looking at their phones. They tend to be soft-fat too, which is scarier to me than the “roid” look because weightlifters are evidently disciplined people. If you’re hoping to get the 8th rep on your 3rd set of whatever on Thursday, you don’t want to screw up in a way that would keep you from getting to the gym on that day. As for Asian cops — this is genuinely frightening. Horrible tortures and physical humiliation as a demonstration of authority are in Chinese DNA. Chinese men tend to be robotic. You don’t want to be at the mercy of a punish-bot.


        July 12, 2016 at 5:45 am

      • A lot of the really inappropriate militarization has to do with drug raids, especially no-knock early dawn ones.

        Don’t do drugs. Don’t deal drugs. Don’t manufacture drugs. Don’t be around people who do.

        No early dawn police raids in your home. Easy peasy.

        Andrew E.

        July 12, 2016 at 12:10 pm

      • @Andrew E.: Don’t do drugs. Don’t deal drugs. Don’t manufacture drugs. Don’t be around people who do.

        Avoid stupid people, stupid places, and stupid things.

        E. Rekshun

        July 12, 2016 at 5:33 pm

  8. Philando was stopped because he matched the description in a BOLO of an armed robbery suspect of a local convenience store just three days earlier.

    Confirmed – Philando Castile Was an Armed Robbery Suspect – False Media Narrative Now Driving Cop Killings…
    From the radio dispatch of Officer Jeronimo Yanez:

    “I’m going to stop a car. I’m going to check IDs. I have reason to pull it over.”

    “The two occupants just look like people that were involved in a robbery. The driver looks more like one of our suspects, just ‘cause of the wide set nose.”

    Here’s Philando’s driving arrest records:

    In Ramsey County, where Castile lived, Castile had the following traffic offenses on his record, according to a search of Minnesota criminal and petty court records:

    1. Violate instr permit – dismissed
    2. No proof of insurance – guilty
    3. Basic speed – guilty
    4. Driving after suspension – dismissed
    5. No proof of insurance – guilty
    6. No seat belt use – dismissed
    7. No proof of insurance – guilty
    8. Impede traffic – dismissed
    9. No Minnesota driver’s license – amended charge guilty
    10. Driving after suspension of driver’s license – Convicted
    11. No proof of insurance – dismissed
    12. No proof of insurance – convicted
    13. Driving after revocation – Dismissed
    15. Driving after suspension – Dismissed
    16. No proof of insurance – guilty
    17. Speeding – dismissed
    18. Driver’s license – failure to obtain new – dismissed
    19. Muffler required – dismissed
    20. Driving after revocation – guilty
    21. Operation of motor vehicle after loss of license prohibited – dismissed
    22. Dangerous public road/water – convicted
    23. Driving after revocation – convicted
    24. No proof of insurance – dismissed
    25. Driving after revocation – convicted
    26. Seat belt violation – dismissed
    27. Driving after revocation – convicted
    28. Proof on insurance – Dismissed
    29. Driving after revocation – convicted
    30. Driving after revocation – convicted
    31. Driving after revocation – convicted
    32. Seat belt required – convicted
    33. Seat belt required – convicted
    34. Driving after revocation – convicted
    35. Driving after revocation – convicted
    36. Driving after revocation – convicted
    37. Driving after revocation – convicted
    38. Driving after revocation – convicted
    39. Driving after revocation – convicted
    40. Stop/stand/park vehicle at any place where official signs prohibit stopping – convicted
    41. Expired registration – dismissed
    42. Snow emergency parking restrictions – convicted
    43. Stop/stand/park vehicle on any street/ally, at the same location, for more than 48 consecutive hours – convicted
    44. Abandon motor vehicle on any public/private property without consent – convicted
    45. Stop/stand/park vehicle on any street/ally, at the same location, for more than 48 consecutive hours – convicted

    Given Philando’s utter disregard for the law concerning normal driving requirements,
    does it really seem likely that Philando would bother to meet the training requirements and $100.00 fee
    required to have a valid MN pistol permit, as his girlfriend, Lavish, claims?

    Even though these are misdemeanors, does MN even issue a permit to someone with a record like this?

    Nedd Ludd

    July 11, 2016 at 1:34 pm

    • I have a Minnesota carry permit, and having been through the full process you are required to complete to get one, I’d guess there’s only about a 5-10% chance he actually had one. To get a MN permit, you have to complete a fairly intensive class that takes up a whole day, and you have to pay for the privilege of doing it. (Note that this payment is separate from the permit payment.)

      I just can’t see a man with Castile’s record having the patience or presence of mind to bother going through the legal process. I’m not sure if they’d be willing to issue him one if he did try to go through it, either.


      July 11, 2016 at 10:44 pm

    • theconservativetreehouse consistently overplays their hand on these things and isn’t a reliable source but even if everything you were saying is true, how does him having an illegal gun mean that it was justifiable force? I have no doubt the guy is a piece of shit, the black lives matter strategy is to focus on the pieces of shit to get other pieces of shit violently angry about it, but you don’t get to shoot all the pieces of shit and shooting is not an efficient way to deal with the pieces of shit we have.


      July 12, 2016 at 1:47 am

  9. O/T, but this thought is scaring me:

    Trump wouldn’t have…Bruce Jenner as his VP? Would he?

    If you go through all reasons the thought is insane and won’t ever happen, then I’ll be relieved. But they have been spending an awful lot of time together, and it would utterly torpedo his campaign.


    July 11, 2016 at 2:10 pm

    • In a gentrifying neighborhood where there are still a lot of poor black people, and he was walking around alone at 4:20 AM.

      Lion of the Blogosphere

      July 11, 2016 at 9:27 pm

    • Hardly gentrifying, this neighborhood is violent and dangerous…

      A Look at Crime in Bloomingdale. The homicide rate is down in the MPD’s Fifth District, which includes Bloomingdale, Brookland and Trinidad. Seven people have been killed this year, compared with 15 people in the same period last year, police data shows. But robberies are up. The number of reported robberies in which a gun was used rose about 12 percent, from 113 to 126. The number of robberies in which a gun was not used rose about 8 percent, from 181 to 195.

      E. Rekshun

      July 12, 2016 at 5:43 pm

  10. My wife and I were pulled over twice in two different states on one three-hour drive last Thanksgiving. One of our headlights was out. That’s all the reason they need.


    July 11, 2016 at 8:43 pm

    • If one of your headlights is out then you should be pulled over. I can’t believe you didn’t replace it the first time you were stopped. Police don’t have to tell me twice. “Thank you, officer. Can you tell me where the closest Walmart is?”


      July 11, 2016 at 11:04 pm

      • I can’t tell if that’s sarcasm


        July 12, 2016 at 1:29 am

      • I don’t make a habit of driving with one headlight, but if you drive much at night you know how many cars are on the road with only one working headlight. That’s why I was surprised to be pulled over twice on the one night when I had that problem.

        The police are doing their job. In fact, if you have a cop behind you at a stop light, he is running your license plate number on his dash computer, and looking up the driver to whom the car is registered. He can see your whole driving record in seconds.


        July 12, 2016 at 3:04 am

      • Right. I believe strongly in the broken taillights theory. This is *not* sarcasm: allowing people to drive around with variously broken up cars is a direct route to societal collapse. As it is, our society is treading water. Or living on fumes. Or whatever simile you prefer.

        BTW, I agree with the gentleman who expressed doubts that Castile’s gun was legal. Is there a way to check on this?


        July 12, 2016 at 8:59 am

      • Most people don’t know how to change their headlight like destructure suggested even if they have the time to do so in the course of one three hour drive. His comment was ridiculous but apparently sincere.


        July 13, 2016 at 2:40 am

    • Gothamette,

      “Right. I believe strongly in the broken taillights theory. This is *not* sarcasm: allowing people to drive around with variously broken up cars is a direct route to societal collapse.”

      Except police aren’t doing their jobs. What you are seeing is “anarcho-tyranny,” a combination of anarchy and tyranny. The police cannot solve crimes, prevent crimes or protect people, but they can make sure you get ticketed for a broken tailight.

      Don’t get me wrong. There is a war on cops going on and BLM is a terrorist organization. Both represent the larger war being fought against White people. But there are dangerous cops running around, just by virtue of who police departments hire and how they train.


      July 12, 2016 at 12:34 pm

  11. Lion: can you do a LOTB post about the film “Welcome to the Dollhouse”. The proles featured in the film were likely very similar to the proles you grew up with. The film really lets the viewer get a sense of prole values and how the differ from true middle class values.

    Otis the Sweaty

    July 11, 2016 at 11:52 pm

  12. MN, unlike NH & VT, where I live, requires a permit to simply purchase a gun.
    It now occurs to me that perhaps – only perhaps – Philandro might have actually obtained a MN
    “permit to purchase” a handgun and that that is what his ‘grrlfriend’, Lascivious, was referring to.

    This MN purchase permit is apparently free and does not require a training course,
    but importantly, it does not allow you to carry a gun, only to purchase it and
    keep it on your own property.

    In Minnesota, you must obtain a handgun permit to carry a gun either openly or concealed on (or near) your body; unless you are on your own property, at your place of business, or engaged in lawful hunting activities. But not everyone may carry a gun, and having a permit does not mean that you may always carry a gun wherever you like. (Mn. Stat. Ann. § 624.714.)

    Penalties for Gun Carry Violations in MN
    It is a gross misdemeanor to carry a concealed firearm without a permit in Minnesota.
    Penalties include a fine of up to $3,000, up to one year in jail, or both.

    Nedd Ludd

    July 12, 2016 at 10:20 am

    • That’s a good find. I’ve not heard that yet from the “news.” Apparently no one in the media is curious in the slightest.

      Mike Street Station

      July 12, 2016 at 12:25 pm

  13. IHTG

    July 12, 2016 at 6:39 pm

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