Lion of the Blogosphere

Panel of undecided voter says Trump won

The results of my panel of one undecided voter are in. The voter says that Trump did a much better job this debate, he kept Hillary on the defensive instead of the other way around, and he was much more prepared.

Written by Lion of the Blogosphere

October 9, 2016 at 11:23 pm

Posted in Politics

74 Responses

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  1. Trump was much better prepared for this debate. He did do some preparation. He did have his attack lines down and kept coming back to them.

    Trump was almost entirely attack lines and he constantly interrupted like Tim Kaine did in the VP debate. I guess Trump liked Tim Kaine’s VP debate performance better than his running mate. Hillary seemed much more calm and collected. She had some attack lines but also could talk about policy much more than Trump.

    I still think Trump lost the debate, but not as badly as the first debate.


    October 9, 2016 at 11:51 pm

    • He really did not interrupt that much as simply not allow the moderators and Hillary to run the show.


      October 10, 2016 at 1:08 am

    • The moderators interrupted Trump more than anything. Raddatz was completely in the tank for Hillary. At one point she was actually arguing against Trump’s points. She was worse than Candy Crowley with Romney.


      October 10, 2016 at 11:53 am

      • ” Raddatz was completely in the tank for Hillary.”

        In fairness, Trump has a habit of blathering on.

        But look at Raddatz’s husbands: 1. Ben Bradlee, Jr. 2. Some Democrat official, look it up, and 3) Tom Gjelten, who wrote a book on the 1965 Immigration Act:

        “When the law was passed, fewer than five percent of Americans were foreign born. Fifty years later, immigrants made up nearly 14 percent of the U.S. population, and the composition of the foreign born population had changed dramatically. The 1965 Act abolished the national origin quotas that favored immigrants from Europe and discriminated against all others. The United States for the first time became a country that officially welcomed people of all nationalities.”

        They are honest about what happened. They think it’s great.


        October 10, 2016 at 3:41 pm

      • “In fairness, Trump has a habit of blathering on.”

        Trump does tend to ramble . But Hillary was going past her time limit as well. I’m talking about how the moderators treated them.

        Matt Lauer was actually fair in that first preliminary debate skirmish. But the MSM bashed Lauer relentlessly to send a message to future moderators. I’ll bet there’s probably another “journolist” where they coordinate.

        In my opinion, the 1965 immigration act was treason. Something interesting — the US, UK, Canada and Australia ALL changed their immigration laws within about 18 months of each other. That was no coincidence.


        October 10, 2016 at 8:03 pm

      • Moderators Raddatz, Cooper and Lester Holt are all minions of the mainstream media. 99% of the mainstream media is anti-Trump and liberal.

        But how right leaning is Trump? If he becomes president, he vouches to help NAMs.


        October 10, 2016 at 11:36 pm

      • “But how right leaning is Trump? If he becomes president, he vouches to help NAMs.”

        And why shouldn’t he help NAMs? They need help. But there’s a difference between giving them the help they need vs looting whitey and race-baiting. The interesting thing about ‘newspeak’ is that one can describe the same thing in opposite ways or opposite things the same way.


        October 11, 2016 at 1:46 am

  2. trump dick slapped her.

    for those who claim to disagree, i agree with “slave” and say…

  3. The Leak of Trump’s 2005 Interview was a Mistake

    What a mistake for Clinton to assume Trump could ever be embarrassed in any way by anything he has said or done. Her latest October surprise only served to infuriate him coming into the debate where he then took his anger out on her in classic form. Another dire consequence for her is that by playing the abuser card she has handed Trump license to continually raise the issue of her enabling of Bill Clinton’s sexual abuse and harassment until election day.

    Trump’s superior megalomania moves the race back to a 50-50 contest.

    What else? My sidebar image of Lincoln has strong objections to Hillary’s description of Lincoln’s honesty. But the integrity of Lincoln was avenged nicely by Trump. I have nothing else to complain about except to regret Trump didn’t perform like this in the first debate.

    The Undiscovered Jew

    October 9, 2016 at 11:57 pm

    • I agree with your points. And he can do even better in the 3rd debate.


      October 10, 2016 at 2:43 am

    • I certainly think that Bill Clinton, sitting their looking hugely uncomfortable, wishes that tape hadn’t been leaked. I had low expectations for this, but Trump has recovered about as well as anyone could have hoped for. I mean, no other politician could have fought back the way he has and even won the debate after the last few days.


      October 10, 2016 at 3:32 am

      • It reminds me of a famous line from Neitszche.


        October 11, 2016 at 8:21 am

    • “What a mistake for Clinton to assume Trump could ever be embarrassed in any way by anything he has said or done.”

      True – but do you think it was the Clinton camp who exposed the tape, or the Bush/CIA camp?


      October 10, 2016 at 3:53 pm

    • And he can do even better in the 3rd debate.

      He is hard to stop when he finds an effective method of attack.

      The Undiscovered Jew

      October 10, 2016 at 8:06 pm

    • I certainly think that Bill Clinton, sitting their looking hugely uncomfortable, wishes that tape hadn’t been leaked.

      He looked like he realized how large of a mistake it was.

      I had low expectations for this,

      You should never have lost faith in the great cult leader.

      The Undiscovered Jew

      October 10, 2016 at 8:08 pm

    • True – but do you think it was the Clinton camp who exposed the tape, or the Bush/CIA camp?

      The Clinton camp. Any decent team of opposition researchers could have found that tape.

      The Undiscovered Jew

      October 10, 2016 at 8:09 pm

      • ” I’ll bet there’s probably another “journolist” where they coordinate.”

        Maybe. Or maybe it’s just that cold sweat you break into when you contemplate people socially snubbing you at the Hamptons.

        “Something interesting — the US, UK, Canada and Australia ALL changed their immigration laws within about 18 months of each other. That was no coincidence.”

        No coincidence but nothing especially sinister. The feeling was that “we” needed labor, new blood, and that the lesser breeds could easily assimilate. It was a period of ridiculous optimism. An epidemiologist said that infectious disease had been cured, and in 10 years we’d cure cancer. We were delusional in many ways.


        October 10, 2016 at 9:04 pm

      • “The Clinton camp. Any decent team of opposition researchers could have found that tape.”

        The other guy in the tape was a Bush. But, whatever.


        October 10, 2016 at 9:05 pm

      • The other guy in the tape was a Bush. But, whatever.

        Whatever indeed. The Bush camp has been in the Clinton camp since 1992, no?

        The Undiscovered Jew

        October 11, 2016 at 7:24 pm

  4. Trump destroyed her. It was like watching him going after Jeb Bush.

    What is really astonishing is watching Hillary turn red and get frazzled and be forced to defend herself on a territory that Trump created. When she talked about appointing judges that would get rid of Citizens United and Trump chimes in about why she did not use any of the $250 million dollars out of the Clinton Foundation to defray, say, $30 million, of the cost of her campaign so she would not be beholden to special interests, you can see the panicked response in her “respecting the 2nd amendment” and “just wanting to do background checks.” That was really wonderful.

    But there is something even more interesting: how much humanity seems to come to the surface when fear and shame are involved. To see the look and body language of Hillary, Bill and Chelsea when Trump was speaking, probably when he mentioned that he would prosecute them if he wins the presidency. Or, to watch Anderson Cooper’s stiffened posture, almost realizing what he sold his soul for, or watching Raddatz get turned on by talking to a real man…it was really extraordinary. I actually felt sorry for them. It was like they were watching their world collapse before them. Hillary was unable to maintain that smirk and she seemed to have the same reaction when losing to Barack Obama.

    There are so many points of attack for Trump, but I think the next set of debate questions will focus on millennials. There will be questions about education and student loans and especially questions about how technology is affecting the employment market. Here Trump could create his coup de grace: Discharging student loans for the millennials and questioning why, if technology is affecting the workplace so much, do we need all of these immigrants?

    “I have a huge respect for education, but I think that our young people are getting screwed on education policy the same way most Americans are getting screwed on trade and immigration policy. Today’s young people have it a lot tougher than I ever did. Their education leaves them with anywhere from $50,000 to $100,000 in debt with few prospects for earning a middle class salary. In my day, you could pay for two semesters of college with a full time summer job and have enough left over for a down payment on a Camaro. What are we doing to our young people? I’d say bring back the dischargeability of student loans and prioritize our children in the American workplace. Make American Great for them again.”

    Even better will be the coming setup on foreign policy. Wait until it dawns on the American public that enforcing a no-fly zone in Syria means shooting down a Russia plane. Which means WWIII. Trump did not go all out and mention to people that the Democrats and their “humanitarian” nonsense means triggering a world war and possibly a nuclear exchange. This from a party that is steadily weakening and demoralizing and defunding military. I suppose Democrats would be all right with soldiers fighting and dying in high heels.

    Oh, and wait until Trump asks what purpose was Hillary having her own private server supposed to serve? Was she selling State Department secrets to the world? This is a woman that is going to lead you into a world war?

    That debate was just brutal. And it will be even more brutal next time.


    October 10, 2016 at 1:07 am

    • ” Wait until it dawns on the American public that enforcing a no-fly zone in Syria means shooting down a Russia plane.”

      Brilliant. I don’t believe that Trump put it that pithily. Talking on and on about how enforcing the no-fly zone “means WWIII” is too general. Putting it your way exposes Hillary as either a bullshitter (likely) or a psychopath (maybe).


      October 10, 2016 at 3:50 pm

      • He won’t put it at all. He had the chance last night to state clearly that Assad should stay in power, that deposing him will result in even greater suffering and loss of life. He could have pointed out that they played the same tricks to get us into war with Iraq.

        He blew it. I am terribly disappointed.


        October 10, 2016 at 7:51 pm

    • Everyone’s focusing on the photo of Bill, but I found Chelsea’s facial expression more revealing. Her mouth was as tight as…never mind.


      October 10, 2016 at 3:51 pm

  5. Only a complete idiot could say that Hillary won that debate. Trump destroyed her. even the liberal media is admitting Hillary had a rough night. really, lion, any commenter here who clams Hillary won should be banned. they are either a liar or too stupid to live.


    October 10, 2016 at 1:09 am

    • “really, lion, any commenter here who clams Hillary won should be banned. they are either a liar or too stupid to live.”



      October 10, 2016 at 8:10 pm

    • Yeah. I think the most be hilary bots. It was a mortal kombat death scene the first 20 mins.

      The Philosopher

      October 11, 2016 at 3:20 am

  6. It’s ironic because Trump is such a toxic personality for winning the cuck whites you need to win over to win a US Presidential election, but the reality is that he is at his best when the contest is about personality, not policy.

    I do think that the tape leak (which I’m still convinced had no real impact, and I don’t believe the first debate had much impact either) gave Trump the excuse he needed to come out and really hammer Hillary personally, which is his strong suit.

    The people who think Trump won the debate must be living in a different universe. The Mexican Peso is crashing, she’s got her surrogates on twitter cursing and saying she shouldn’t bother with the 3rd debate and there is total consensus that this eliminates all momentum for getting Trump off the ticket (and the fact that people on the Left are trying to spin that as a win for Hillary lets you know that Trump won).

    I don’t think this debate will move any measurably amount of people towards Trump, just like I don’t think the tape and the 1st debate moved people away from him. But Trump won the day and anybody who denies it is subhuman cuck scum.

    Otis the Sweaty

    October 10, 2016 at 1:44 am

  7. Outside observer here (from Australia) with no strong feelings towards either candidate, except disappointment. Because of the essentially non-existent amount of criticism of Hilary that makes it overseas, I often find myself defending Trump simply in the interest of fairness.

    I watched the debate with some left-wing relatives. I countered some of their biased reactions, but to be honest I thought Clinton won the debate. Trump’s answers seemed generally rambling, the sniffling was back, and a lot of what he said didn’t even make sense – he seemed to be suggesting not only that Hilary was part of the establishment, but that she was the ENTIRE establishment and therefore responsible for all legislation that had been passed in the preceding 30 years even if she voted against it personally.

    Having said that, it wasn’t an annihilation and I can easily imagine an event (e.g. terrorist or health related) swinging things back in his favor.


    October 10, 2016 at 5:24 am

    • Trump’s base is living in a bubble of denial. He’s lost support outside his core supporters right now. He lost the debate, because he was starting so far behind. Lion, you need to befriend moderate non-political white women. Trump needed them but has lost them. This race is over.


      October 10, 2016 at 1:30 pm

      • There aren’t any moderate women in NYC, there are only liberals.

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        October 10, 2016 at 2:18 pm

      • If Lion really thinks Trump won the debate and close to winning the election, all he has to do is go on record and say trump will get more than 269 electoral votes. Beat liberal media, Nate Silver all in one post. Cmon Lion. JUse do it !! If u are right, you will get huge following.


        October 10, 2016 at 2:36 pm

      • Agreed.

        These Trump supporters are the sort of people who would’ve nutted themselves if their guy pointed an accusatory finger at Bill Clinton and thundered, “rapist!”

        Predicting elections isn’t about getting in touch with your own feelings, but trying to burrow into the minds of the electorate. It’s like how old newspapers would show pictures of six women and ask readers to predict which one would be voted the prettiest. Anyone might have their own personal opinion, but you have to put that aside to consider how others react.

        Posters on the previous incarnation of this blog predicted a win for Romney four years ago (all of the polls were supposed to be wrong). How did that work out?


        October 10, 2016 at 4:38 pm

      • Vince,

        Four years ago, people believed there was a real opposition party, that the Republicans were not in cahoots with the Democrats to lose graciously and keep the gravy train going. No one believes that anymore, which is why the mask of the GOPe has dropped.


        October 10, 2016 at 8:32 pm

      • “Trump’s base is living in a bubble of denial”

        Boy is that right! Ban anyone who mentions a poll showing Trump behind… yeeesh.

        Talk about your alleged Flight 93 election.. you idiots dont recognize the problem is here. Its not mezitos who started BLM. Its not H1B visa complaining about microagressions. Its not a laborer from El Salvador who came up with ‘cisgender’ thought crime. This is all society destroying nonsense started by good old Americans.

        People was spending down their savings and taking loans to turn their children into robotic little leftists. There is your problem- not an Arab who tried to get his family to this country to prevent them from being blown up by nuts.

        Lena Dunham, Mark Ruffalo, Mark Zuckerberg, Sheryl Sandberg are the people destroying the civilization. Not some poor cobbler from Central America.

        Lion of the Turambar

        October 10, 2016 at 8:59 pm

    • I guess that shows just how different an Australian would perceive things. To even Hillary supporters, she came off as skittish, pandering (a trait she’s known for anyway), and most bothersome to them, evasive.

      Look, if you know anything about American politics, you know that Dem voters don’t like Hillary to begin with and they weren’t happy with the Dem/Clinton machine that cleared the primary field for her anyway, so her performance didn’t come as a surprise to them.

      That said, they’ll still vote for her just as Trump’s supporters will vote for him.

      The biggest problem Trump faces is the GOP as the local headquarters were instructed one way or another to make it difficult for Trump volunteers to organize voter registration drives. The registration was terrific during the primaries, but not hot since because of that “blocking”.

      This is a turnout election: who stays home?


      October 10, 2016 at 2:33 pm

      • “This is a turnout election: who stays home?”

        Good question. One tends to think that all white voters are registered – that’s not true. In trying to get my hands on some numbers, I found this:

        In 2012 there were 152M eligible white voters. 64% of non-Hispanic whites came out to vote. That doesn’t mean the other 36% weren’t registered but they might as well not have been. Jesus, that’s something like 45 bloody million voters. If he could manage to motivate 10% of them to vote (depending on the state, of course), he might have a chance.


        October 10, 2016 at 9:15 pm

    • I can second this in terms of the biased coverage that comes up in NZ newspapers.


      October 10, 2016 at 5:09 pm

    • Please read Otis the Sweaty’s comment just above yours.


      October 10, 2016 at 5:27 pm

  8. Trump was more anti-single payer than ever tonight when asked about healthcare. This is the only thing that gives me pause in voting for him. As bad as Obamacare is, it was a net improvement.


    October 10, 2016 at 7:37 am

    • The key thing is not single payer it’s price controls. Plenty of first world countries with reasonable health care costs don’t have single payer but they all have price controls. I’m sure Trump is equally opposed to price controls so it’s something of a moot point anyway.


      October 10, 2016 at 9:55 am

      • The reason why healthcare is so expensive, why it either accounts for a large percentage of GDP or a higher fraction of American incomes, is because US healthcare subsidizes the healthcare of the entire planet. All of these foreign medical systems profit off of the American citizen. Foreign pharmaceutical companies either make their drugs in the US market or they export them into the US market, taking advantages of the much larger almost monopolistic prices they can charge. Same with medical device and medical equipment companies. Meanwhile, foreign government policies vastly reduce the healthcare costs of their own citizens.

        That is why comparing US healthcare and foreign healthcare is pointless. How can you, when foreign health systems are neither independent or self-contained?

        That is why it is a lie for Hillary to claim that insurance companies account for the costs of healthcare. How can they? All they are doing is passing their own large markups on top of existing markups.

        One way to get around this problem is to make all exports of American medical products subject to a law that requires getting 90% of the American price in foreign markets, with proceeds split between government and private company. That will kill off a lot of socialized medical systems right there and the left will lose the argument.


        October 10, 2016 at 12:13 pm

      • In order to prove your point you would have to show that the disparities in health care costs only exist in the small fraction of expenses that have the dynamic you’re talking about. I think it’s pretty obvious that such a small portion of expenses couldn’t have such an oversized effects on overall spending and that there are large disparities across the board but I don’t have the data.

        Then you would have to establish that all this extra money going to the pharmaceutical industry and medical device manufacturers actually does some good for the world and that the US is somehow doing the world a service by padding their incomes rather than just being giant suckers. I think there’s good reason to doubt that that’s the case. For instance, there is tremendous waste in pharmaceutical budgets that goes to advertising and scientifically worthless pseudo advertisement research, both of which don’t do the world any good and ought to be illegal (and are illegal in many other first world nations).

        Even if what you said is true it’s just another argument for bringing our health care costs in line with the rest of the world. We shouldn’t let the rest of the world exploit us in order to lower their health care costs just like we shouldn’t be paying for their defense or enacting a trade policy that funnels them hundreds of billions of dollars a year


        October 10, 2016 at 4:01 pm

      • Magnavox,

        All medicine is just pharmaceuticals, devices and equipment. That is what you’re paying for. What, do you think your paying for the doctor? You could be stuck on a desert island with the best thoracic surgeon on the planet, but if you came down with appendicits, then the most he could do is diagnose how you’re going to die.

        I would be for price controls on these items, but that is not what the Democrats want. They simply want to rope in more people as dependent on them for their existence. They’ve largely succeeded. It’s bribes for votes. Or, population replacement for votes. Or, war for votes.


        October 10, 2016 at 8:39 pm

      • The reason healthcare (aka “medical care”) is so expensive is because the alternative to paying whatever they ask for in exchange for their goods and services is really unpleasant. People need those Epipens – it’s a matter of life and death – so Mylan is able to charge six hundred dollars for them. The same goes for all medical services. Your ophthalmologist doesn’t make four hundred grand because she “worked so hard” to get where she is. She makes that much because when your eye hurts like hell, you’ll give up just about anything to get her assistance.

        Think about it, in most other fields you have to hold quite a title to make that kind of money, but almost all doctors have a high income, even though most of them poor mouth like they’re on the brink of having to live in the gutter. They’ll look you dead in the eye and tell you that it’s “not a big money profession” anymore. They think they deserve a lot more, because they compare themselves to investment bankers and big CEO’s instead of ordinary people.

        And in what profession other than nursing can some rural party girl with an associates degree make sixty or seventy thousand dollars a year with great job security and mobility?

        The lunatics are running the asylum, and the government not only allows them to continue, they assist them in ripping us all off.


        October 10, 2016 at 9:02 pm

      • Yeah, that epipen stuff is bad optics. Sticking it to pharma is very reasonable.


        October 10, 2016 at 11:55 pm

      • All medicine is just pharmaceuticals, devices and equipment. That is what you’re paying for. What, do you think your paying for the doctor? You could be stuck on a desert island with the best thoracic surgeon on the planet, but if you came down with appendicitis, then the most he could do is diagnose how you’re going to die.

        Yes of course you’re paying for the doctors salary (as well as that of the nurses, and of the rest of the staff, and for the building, and any number of things that are not “pharmaceuticals, devices and equipment”. What a stupid thing to say.

        I would be for price controls on these items, but that is not what the Democrats want. They simply want to rope in more people as dependent on them for their existence. They’ve largely succeeded. It’s bribes for votes. Or, population replacement for votes. Or, war for votes.

        Its clear from this comment and your previous one that you just have some emotional attachment to capitalism and the “free” market. We have had utilities with price controls, sometimes privately held and sometimes owned by the government, for hundreds of years in this country. Get over it.

        Does buying my water from the government make a communist? I don’t think so. And like I said private vs public ownership doesn’t even matter.


        October 11, 2016 at 5:29 am

      • The reason healthcare (aka “medical care”) is so expensive is because the alternative to paying whatever they ask for in exchange for their goods and services is really unpleasant.

        And in most areas letting people charge whatever they can get away with works very well. But there are many areas of our economy where we have realized that a “free” market doesn’t work, notably utilities, while the rest of the developed world but not the US has recognized that health care needs similar regulation.

        Yeah, that epipen stuff is bad optics. Sticking it to pharma is very reasonable

        But it’s not just superficial optics. It’s a particularly egregious and prominent example of a much larger, deeper problem.


        October 11, 2016 at 5:32 am

      • Magnavox,

        Where do you get this fantasy that medicine is some sort of free market? Medicine is one of the most heavily regulated economic entities on the planet. The government has its hands in every aspect of medical practice, from accrediting medical schools, to licensing doctors, to approving medicine and medical devices, to class action lawsuits. Furthermore, the government has been doing this for decades.

        The result of all of this government meddling is skyrocketing medical costs across every area. The government has simply established a private-public partnership where it allows medicine to extract huge amounts of money from the general public in exchange for a cut. And then, it propagandizes the experience of foreign governments to gain even more control so that it can solidify this public-private extractive entity. Basically, if medicine is there to rip people off and control them then it does so with the government’s blessing.

        And you want these same people to fix the problem?

        The only saving grace of this expensive system is that medicine is very high quality and readily available. Yet, you continue this lie that foreign experiences should be driving our policies.


        October 11, 2016 at 12:42 pm

      • Magnavox,

        “Does buying my water from the government make a communist? I don’t think so. And like I said private vs public ownership doesn’t even matter.”

        Nobody is trying to charge you $1800 a month for water for a family of four with a $10,000 deductible. Or, to redirect your water supplies to the benefit of foreigners. Or, shutting down the utilities that provide water in your area. All of which is happening with medicine.

        You have this childish view that a “free market” exists in medicine because somebody is making a good living at it.


        October 11, 2016 at 1:06 pm

      • Socialized medicine could work and work well. If there aren’t enough doctors, educate more of them; there is no shortage of people who want to become doctors, but there is a shortage of opportunities. There is no need for people in countries like Canada and the UK to wait for weeks or months to see a specialist. These are problems that can be solved without throwing out the current system.

        How’s this for socialism: maybe the government should get into the pharmaceutical business. Instead of wasting money on upgrading our nuclear forces or carrying out airstrikes in Syria, maybe the federal government should set up a factory or two and start manufacturing generic drugs – at substantially reduced cost. They could actually turn a profit.


        October 11, 2016 at 9:08 pm

  9. IHTG

    October 10, 2016 at 9:49 am

  10. Trump won the second debate bigly…Believe me.


    October 10, 2016 at 10:27 am

    • For some reason, “believe me” from Trump is a lot more trustworthy than “believe me” from a typical politician or from the used car salesman.

      Does he say “bigly”, “big league”, or both?


      October 10, 2016 at 1:19 pm

    • Yeah I would say Trump won the debate, but on points. He really needs to annihilate Hillary on the 3rd debate or it won’t make a difference. Winning that debate has gotten him no traction this week.

      Mike Street Station

      October 11, 2016 at 10:57 pm

  11. The best thing Trump did last night was to pay Hillary a genuine and deserved compliment. Hillary’s response to that question came off as forced and dishonest, while Trump’s was obviously genuine and made without reservation. Many may have tuned out by that point in the debate, but for those who saw it, it was an incredibly humanizing moment for Trump. Also, it speaks to his intellectual honesty.


    October 10, 2016 at 11:24 am

    • Yes, he is willing to give credit where credit is due. It takes humility and self-discipline to compliment your opponent after a heated debate and in light of what just leaked 48 hours ago. Her response to the question, however, gives the impression that she tried hard not to compliment him directly. It’s hubris. I would trust him more than I would trust her.


      October 10, 2016 at 1:08 pm

    • Intellectual honesty. In the previous debate he said she lacked stamina, but now she’s a tireless fighter.


      October 10, 2016 at 10:56 pm

  12. Thinking about it more, I think Trump was trying to energize his base in this debate. He was not even trying to appeal to general election voters. The base wants to see Hillary attacked over the emails, Benghazi and Bill Cinton’s affairs. Trump did all that. It definitely is energizing his base. It is what they have wanted to see Trump do. My feeling is it fell flat with general election voters outside the base. They have heard all this before. My guess is women in particular were turned off by Trump bringing up Bill Clinton’s accusers.

    Before this debate a lot of Republicans were un-endorsing Trump. In this debate Trump got the base excited which will make it very hard for any more Republicans to un-endorse Trump.

    By the way if you believe Trump’s claim that the pussygate tape was just locker room bragging and he has never sexually assaulted women, you should read this interview with Jill Harth:


    October 10, 2016 at 12:06 pm

  13. Is Mikeca a Hillary/Soros paid shill doing the concern troll thing? sure seems like it. The truth is Trump decimated Hillary last night and EVERYONE knows it. Trump unleashed is like a force of nature.


    October 10, 2016 at 1:59 pm

    • The Trump base and Republican base (largely the same) believe Trump decimated Hillary in last nights debate.

      The CNN debate poll says 57% think Clinton won to 34% that think Trump won.

      That 34% is pretty much the Republican/Trump base. People outside that group were not so impressed.

      I’m not a big fan of HIllary, but Trump is too erratic and unserious. I don’t think he wants to win. He has some plan to monetize losing. He doesn’t care.

      Apparently I’m not too smart, because no one is paying me to write these comments here. Who is paying you?


      October 10, 2016 at 3:34 pm

      • -Mexican peso tanking
        -Trump’s odds went up in betting markets
        -All talk of the GOP replacing Trump ended
        -Trump supporters jubilent
        -Hillary supporters enraged
        -Redstate calling debate a victory for Trump
        -Krauthammer calling it a victory for Trump
        -Hillary spokes”man” getting so angry he cursed Trump out on Twitter, and the Hillay campaign apologizing for it
        -Hillary supporters claiming that the debate was good because it prevented the possibility of Trump being replaced
        -Vox writing articles that Trump threatened the foundations of American democracy
        -Talk from some Hillary supporters that she should skip the 3rd debate

        Those things don’t happen unless Trump won and won clearly.

        Will Trump’s performance convince anyone to vote for him? Of course not, and it wasn’t supposed to. Everybody’s mind was already made up before the first debate. Trump was out to regain the initiative and put Crooked Hillary on the defensive, and he did just that.

        Otis the Sweaty

        October 10, 2016 at 6:15 pm

      • I think people judge Hillary and Donald by very different standards in these debates. I don’t like Hillary, but she seems the more polished speaker who packs more detail into her answers. But then she is judged by a higher standard, and if you don’t like her she has the kind of voice it’s easy to tune out whilst you think to yourself ‘I hope Donald grabs her by the rhetorical pussy and slams her to the floor in a minute’.

        Conversely, because Donald was so poor in the first debate, and because his supporters want to see someone who will take the fight to the Democrats, it’s easy to become caught up in his aggressive responses and overestimate the impact they have on others. It’s like willing Rocky to get up off the canvas and land some blows on the commie Ivan Drago. In truth he was often so busy attacking Hilllary that he offered little in the way of reasons to vote for him, other than not being Hillary. He does repeat himself a lot. A lot of his answers rely on a single statistic or insight followed by waffle to fill the time up. It’s like “did you know there’s 45% unemployment in the inner city? 45%! F-O-R-T-Y F-I-V-E! I’m not kidding. Huge problems there. Huuuuuge problems. So terrible. I’m not kidding. Just awful, awful stuff. Huge.” I will give him credit for having the force of personality to make a little go a long way–his waffle is more ear-catching than Hillary’s complete sentences. But I do think some of your readers are kidding themselves.

        That said….politics isn’t rational and maybe people are more swayed by emotion than content, in which case perhaps it can be argued that he won on those terms.

        prolier than thou

        October 10, 2016 at 6:57 pm

      • 58% of CNN’s polled debate watchers were self identified Hillary supporters before the debate. If CNN polled a sample that was 60% Trump voters, what do you think the result would have been? And of that wildly pro-Hillary sample, 63% admitted Trump did better than they expected compared to only 39% who felt Hillary did better than expected. This was a landslide victory for Trump.


        October 10, 2016 at 8:17 pm

      • Mikeca,

        That same poll said their “representative sample” was 534 people with only 27% registered Republican.


        October 10, 2016 at 8:28 pm

  14. Felt that a low energy Trump was clearly bested in the first debate. But last night was the most dominating debate performance of my lifetime. Trump trounced her. My analysis is almost always spot on but perusing Facebook and Twitter immediately afterwards confirmed it. All my progressive friends were totally deflated. People with no real interest in politics all saw it as a blowout. The Billy Bush leak was a huge strategic error. It has totally reinvigorated Trump. Watching his speech in Pennsylvania right now and he is on fire like I’ve never seen him before.


    October 10, 2016 at 4:44 pm

  15. If you’ve ever wondered where these anti-Trump concern trolls come from read what Hillary did against Bernie:

    “The Daily Beast reports that Clinton SuperPac “Correct the Record” is openly admitting to spending $1 million to hire fake online Hillary supporters to swarm social media sites like Reddit and counteract Sanders’ [actually existent unpaid] enthusiastic supporters’ points about Hillary…”

    we have a lot of these HiIlary paid shills here posing as normal people. Anyone who claims HiIlary won last night’s debate is likely to be one of Hillary’s employees.


    October 10, 2016 at 10:28 pm

  16. OT:

    Fascinating link. Bill Ivey arguing that people have to kept like dumb sheep


    October 11, 2016 at 2:21 am

  17. i dont doubt there are heaps of pro-hillary shills astroturfing on the web out there for her, but i kind of doubt they’d bother with this place.

    james n.s.w

    October 11, 2016 at 3:29 am

  18. Trump didnt gain voters.

    He merely did his job by stopping her voters from turning out. Notice how he mentioned berne sanders more than obama.

    The debate was about nullifying women and younger voters. He did that. He may have even culled some perctage points off the black vote.

    The cnn poll is rigged. Just like their moderators and news coverage. Or wmd. Or georgia attacking russia or any other large story youd care to mention

    Trumps job as i kept saying was to attack the moderator and by association show how the whole media is biased. Expose the charade. Make the tape look like a silly hit job. He couldnt do that with magic negro which is why the 1st was bad.

    People here saying trump lost are out of their minds with stupidity. He nullified the tape and turned it into a national conversaion about bills rape victims who appeared on camera grim and sad which maybe stopped 20% of bernie supporters frm bothering to vote and energised his base in a way unprecedented for a cuckold republican.

    His weakness is vlearly having to adopt the cuckold taxation policy which is retarded. He knows its retarded. But its the price he pays for not being openly sabotaged by the Cuckolds. Trump should drop the trickle down cayman policy and he would definitely appeal to the centre. Because trade immigration and criminal justice positions are fine.

    The Philosopher

    October 11, 2016 at 3:36 am

    • Actually, I’d say Trump is being openly sabotaged now. Paul Ryan just had his little coup de cuck moment. He probably wishes he could take it back though.

      Also, recall the DNC wikileaks, which I seem to recall detail how the Dems are in bed with (and/or directing) the media. Hell yeah this is rigged rigged rigged rigged.


      October 11, 2016 at 12:52 pm

  19. More Wikileaks:


    October 11, 2016 at 8:35 am

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