Lion of the Blogosphere

Susan Rice thing

I’m rooting for Trump, and I would like nothing more than for this to be the smoking gun that damns the Obama administration, but I have no idea if there’s anything really there. I certainly don’t want to get my hopes up and then feel stupid that I fell for a dumb conspiracy theory.

Written by Lion of the Blogosphere

April 5, 2017 at 12:59 am

Posted in Politics

36 Responses

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  1. At this point, it’s clear the Obama administration was spying on Trump. Susan Rice (coughObamacough) violated protocol in unmasking the Trump associates, and the Obama administration revised intelligence sharing rules so that the reports would spread widely throughout the government.

    The fact that it’s Susan Rice, whose credibility has already been scorched from Benghazi, adds to the PR mess.

    That said, what I’m not sure of is how bad this will hit Obama’s reputation. It’s apparent this was more of Obama’s weasely doings, but none of them ever did much damage to his reputation, largely because the media wouldn’t cover it. Most Americans came thinking Obama was scandal-free. It certainly had more to do with how he was presented than from his behavior.

    Sid

    April 5, 2017 at 1:27 am

  2. For me this is classic bannon reframing and trump playing hardball. The following are all facts:

    Everyone is spied upon
    They have trump’s associates convos
    Rice was ordered to peek

    Also true:
    Russians, like us and everyone else, have preferences in elections and “meddle.” Were foreign leaders who bad mouthed trump during the campaign trying to influence the election? Of course.

    The angle is getting the media to emphasize one set of obvious facts over the other.

    Joe

    April 5, 2017 at 1:32 am

  3. We don’t want to become NeoGaf or DKos where the users have actually been expecting, not just hoping, that the Russia stuff will bring Trump down any day now, but we do have something here.

    When looking at these kinds of scandals, it is important to keep several things in mind:

    1. The public is vastly more polarized than during the 70s and is willing to overlook corruption as long as it is done by their side, whichever side that may be.

    2. Nixon was done in over the profane and cynical language he used on the tapes he idiotically made of him conspiring to cover up Watergate break in. There has never been even the suggestion that there was some sort of similar smoking gun visa vi Trump and the Russians so Trumpgate was always destined to go nowhere, even if it actually was true.

    3. With Rice and Farkas the truth is different, we already have the smoking gun that evil Obama and the evil intelligence agencies were illegally spying on Trump.

    This isn’t the kind of stuff that is going to get Obama arrested, but it is going to drag out thus disrupting the Democrats Russia narrative while greatly undermining the credibility of the open borders Intelligence Community.

    With this story, the 17 year low in illegal border crossings and the upcoming Gorusch confirmation, we are changing the narrative. The real keys are going to be getting the SC to overturn the stay on Trump’s muslim ban and starting construction of the wall. Do those 2 things and Trump’s popularity should rebound a little, although he is always going to be unpopular overall because his temperament turns off so many centrist whites.

    Otis the Sweaty

    April 5, 2017 at 2:06 am

    • There has never been even the suggestion that there was some sort of similar smoking gun visa vi Trump and the Russians so Trumpgate was always destined to go nowhere, even if it actually was true.

      There’s probably nothing to a Trump-Russia connection that was illegal at all. If there was something remotely criminal in nature about it Rice would have leaked it during the campaign. This angle to the story is probably exhausted.

      However, the legality of Obama’s monitoring of Trump is only just beginning to be investigated.

      The only victory the Democrats are likely to get out of this is the removal of Mike Flynn in exchange for causing former Obama administration officials years of legal problems and their Trump-Russia conspiracy theory sailing off course.

      The Undiscovered Jew

      April 5, 2017 at 6:30 pm

  4. Simple guide: ALL AMERICANS are currently being illegally spied upon by the government.
    Therefore it is trivially true that Trump was illegally spied upon by the Obama administration.

    Was the Obama administration spying on Trump for political reasons and not just as part of the incidental illegal spying on the other millions of US citizens? Logic dictates almost certainly. In control of all that power and won’t use it to prevent someone so ‘deplorable’ racist, sexist, & white male from getting into power? For a liberal breaking the law is the only moral thing to do.

    Panther of the Blogocube

    April 5, 2017 at 2:33 am

  5. The entire establishment, news media, and of course the Democratic Party, has fallen for a dumb conspiracy theory; that Trump “colluded” with the Russians to flip the election to him. That’s every bit as idiotic as birtherism, and far more dangerous for the body politic.

    Mike Street Station

    April 5, 2017 at 6:01 am

  6. It’s clear that she lied in the past about the extent to which there was surveillance of Trump’s people, and that is very suspicious. But it’s equally clear that the MSM isn’t going to cover the story any more than they absolutely have to and if need be will gladly run interference for Rice and the Democrats, so I kind of doubt it will turn into much, unfortunately. At a minimum though it exonerates Trump for his infamous “wiretapp” tweet because the absolute madman was basically correct.

    Two in the Bush

    April 5, 2017 at 8:08 am

    • That “absolute madman” has an awfully inconvenient habit (for an absolute madman) of being proved right, again and again and again.

      Perhaps its because he’s an evil genius as well as an absolute madman (yet still a Putin stooge strangely enough).

      Or maybe he’s just a brash and crude NY real estate developer and neither evil nor mad.

      Funny how blasé the media are about spying on US citizens and political opponents when its their guy doing the spying.

      gda

      April 5, 2017 at 11:22 am

  7. how come everyone on the confirmation committees knew to ask questions about on the record about contacts with Russia?

    why did the press have the whole russia thing ginned to a fever pitch before Flynn? The unmasking went to more than Rice and Franken- Democrat operatives had to know things too.

    Lion of the Turambar

    April 5, 2017 at 8:14 am

  8. Andrew McCarthy has had some excellent analysis of this. His latest from yesterday:

    http://www.nationalreview.com/article/446415/susan-rice-unmasking-trump-campaign-members-obama-administration-fbi-cia-nsa

    Andrew E.

    April 5, 2017 at 9:08 am

    • Andrew McCarthy is typically the best guy to read about stuff regarding this. He has a very intimate knowledge about how the national security infrastructure is arranged. Like Victor Davis Hanson, he was never a die-hard Trump supporter but voted for him (or against Hillary). He’s probably as objective as you are going to get. He seems to think that this is a big deal and I believe him. I’m amazed that the rest of the media is not covering it.

      JerseyGuy

      April 5, 2017 at 12:13 pm

  9. I don’t think Rice is that bright, she’s clearly an affirmative action hire, and she may be telling the truth to some extent when she plays dumb on this. As much as I would love to see Obama himself brought down I think what this whole spying operation shows is that there is a massive network of traitors and globalists throughout the bureaucracy and the intelligence community with their hands in this, starting with Rice’s subordinate Ben Rhodes, and it is this network that needs to be exposed and prosecuted rather than Obama.

    Andrew E.

    April 5, 2017 at 9:12 am

  10. I was watching NBC Nightly News yesterday, and all of the reporting about Susan Rice was presented in such a way as to state that the Trump administration was using her as a way to distract from the “Russia scandal” (whatever that is, after all this time). It was really bad, in that it wasn’t objective reporting, it was essentially propaganda.

    Yankee

    April 5, 2017 at 9:38 am

    • That’s the MSM evening news that I regularly watch, and as a long time watcher of NBC NIghtly News, I know their MO. If there is any news that’s bad for the establishment, they sit on it until they have an alibi. That’s what happened to this story. They didn’t even mention Rice on the day the story came out, but waited until they could secure an interview with Rice to “clear her.”

      Mike Street Station

      April 6, 2017 at 4:13 pm

  11. Look at the info about how this story came emerged.

    The figure at the center of the Susan Rice claim is Cohen-Watnick. Cohen-Watnick was put on the NSC staff by Mike Flynn. On March 10th McMaster, Flynn’s replacement as National Security Advisor, fired Cohen-Watnick. On March 14th Steve Bannon and Jared Kushner overruled McMaster and told Cohen-Watnick he could stay. Cohen-Watnick apparently started reviewing all intelligence intercepts of the Trump campaign and transition teams. Cohen-Watnick took his information about Susan Rice to the White House counsel’s office which ordered him to stop his investigation because it was inappropriate for the White House staff to be conducting its own investigation of the previous administration. That was the job of Congress and the FBI. After being ordered to stop his investigation, Cohen-Watnick gave his information to Devin Nunes on March 21st.

    Fun fact about Cohen-Watnick, his wife Becky works for a Washington PR firm that provides marketing and PR services to the Russian government according to some reports.

    Look, Cater Page, one of the Trump campaign foreign policy advisers, was recruited by Russian spies in 2013. The FBI secretly taped the Russian spies discussing their effort to cultivate Cater Page as a information source in return for preferential treatment in business deals. Cater Page admits this and says he only gave the spies public information. The unverified Trump dossier given to the FBI in the summer of 2016 claims that the head of a Russian oil company offered Cater Page a stake in the company worth around $1 billion in exchange for his help getting Russian sanctions lifted.

    Why on earth wouldn’t the FBI investigate these claims? Why wouldn’t they brief Susan Rice on the status of that investigation?

    Mike CA

    April 5, 2017 at 10:12 am

    • The fact this story seems to have unnerved libs like this guys tells me it’s got some legs.

      Two in the Bush

      April 5, 2017 at 11:24 am

      • Which story are you talking about?

        The Trump Russia connection story on the surface sounds preposterous. If any reasonable president had those kinds of accusations thrown at him, he would just say I have nothing to hide, reveal all the information you have and let people see there is nothing to it. Instead Trump has generated a stream of accusations with no evidence to back them up as a smoke screen to distract the press. The Susan Rice story just looks like the latest puff of smoke. That is the kind of thing someone with something to hide does.

        More seriously, it is possible that what Cohen-Watnick was actually doing was using his NSC position to monitor the FBI/intelligence investigation of the Trump team.

        If Trump has nothing to hide, why is he acting guilty as hell?

        mikeca

        April 5, 2017 at 12:00 pm

      • I don’t see Trump acting guilty, I see Trump acting like Trump.

      • The figure at the center of the Susan Rice claim is Cohen-Watnick. Cohen-Watnick was put on the NSC staff by Mike Flynn. On March 10th McMaster, Flynn’s replacement as National Security Advisor, fired Cohen-Watnick. On March 14th Steve Bannon and Jared Kushner overruled McMaster and told Cohen-Watnick he could stay. Cohen-Watnick apparently started reviewing all intelligence intercepts of the Trump campaign and transition teams. Cohen-Watnick took his information about Susan Rice to the White House counsel’s office which ordered him to stop his investigation because it was inappropriate for the White House staff to be conducting its own investigation of the previous administration. That was the job of Congress and the FBI. After being ordered to stop his investigation, Cohen-Watnick gave his information to Devin Nunes on March 21st.

        Cohen-Watnick’s actions have nothing to do with whether Susan Rice’s actions were illegal. Whatever Rice did she had done before Cohen-Watnick started working for the Trump administration.

        The Congress and FBI forced Cohen-Watnick to blow the whistle because they weren’t looking into the Obama administration’s treatment of intelligence.

        Look, Cater Page, one of the Trump campaign foreign policy advisers, was recruited by Russian spies in 2013. The FBI secretly taped the Russian spies discussing their effort to cultivate Cater Page as a information source in return for preferential treatment in business deals. Cater Page admits this and says he only gave the spies public information. The unverified Trump dossier given to the FBI in the summer of 2016 claims that the head of a Russian oil company offered Cater Page a stake in the company worth around $1 billion in exchange for his help getting Russian sanctions lifted.

        No one was expecting Trump to run for President (much less win the Presidency) in 2013.

        Whatever Page helped Russia with in 2013 was probably only done to enrich himself, and is irrelevant to the Trump campaign.

        The Undiscovered Jew

        April 5, 2017 at 6:38 pm

      • Instead Trump has generated a stream of accusations with no evidence to back them up as a smoke screen to distract the press.

        Of course there is evidence.

        His accusations the Obama administration illegally monitored his campaign turned out to be true.

        The Susan Rice story just looks like the latest puff of smoke. That is the kind of thing someone with something to hide does.

        Have fun making excuses for former Obama officials for the next several years while they fight off the legal problems their handling of intelligence will cause them.

        More seriously, it is possible that what Cohen-Watnick was actually doing was using his NSC position to monitor the FBI/intelligence investigation of the Trump team.

        Cohen-Watnick was shown the NSA access logs and other documentation showing Rice unmasked private citizens connected with Trump.

        There is nothing illegal about this, and even if there were that doesn’t protect Rice and other Obama advisers from prosecution.

        The Undiscovered Jew

        April 5, 2017 at 6:44 pm

    • Wow. Time to turn off CNN and take a deep breath.

      Now go read Andy McCarthy.

      “There would have been no intelligence need for Susan Rice to ask for identities to be unmasked. If there had been a real need to reveal the identities — an intelligence need based on American interests — the unmasking would have been done by the investigating agencies.

      The national-security adviser is not an investigator. She is a White House staffer. The president’s staff is a consumer of intelligence, not a generator or collector of it. If Susan Rice was unmasking Americans, it was not to fulfill an intelligence need based on American interests; it was to fulfill a political desire based on Democratic-party interests.”
      http://www.nationalreview.com/article/446415/susan-rice-unmasking-trump-campaign-members-obama-administration-fbi-cia-nsa

      This wasn’t a matter of the FBI “brief(ing) Susan Rice on the status of that investigation”. That’s a completely disingenuous question.

      But I guess when you buy into the ridiculous (and so far evidence-free) narrative of a Trump/Putin collaboration it all fits, right?

      gda

      April 5, 2017 at 11:49 am

    • I recall a 2016 background piece in a Foreign Policy type webzine on Carter Page, from just before the Hacking scandal overflowed its banks. It painted Page in an unflattering light, as an opportunist who was scraping by on the fringes of Russia’s oil industry. Page claimed to be a key dealmaker, yet the reporter kept getting quizzical looks when bringing up his name to Russian heavyweights. Trump’s team viewed him partly as “Carter who?” and partly as “Well, we need an expert and this guy says he’s connected.”

      Perhaps tellingly, I can’t locate that article, as Google results are overflowing with more recent exposes of Carter Page the Professor Moriarty of Putin/Trump corruption. Now that he’s a key part of the narrative.

      amac78

      April 5, 2017 at 11:51 am

    • Carter Page is a nobody. He was on a “foreign policy advisory committee” for six months before being fired. This committee never actually met or did anything, nor has Page ever met Trump or anyone in his campaign or administration. There are literally hundreds of such “advisory committees,” to which thousands of people are named, in any given presidential campaign, and in Clinton’s, Obama’s or anyone else’s you can find dozens of such “advisors” who say or do outrageous things, lobby for controversial entities, have rap sheets etc. Page’s status in the campaign was effectively one step above random volunteer. This is an especially absurd case of the GOP lawmaker principle: http://www.slate.com/blogs/weigel/2014/03/18/the_gop_lawmaker_principle_why_you_see_so_many_articles_about_random_right.html

      Moreover, if Putin’s “hacking the election” budget was so enormous as to be able to give a billion dollars to random nobodies semi-affiliated with a campaign near-universally considered sure to lose, why not budget enough for the actual hacking as to do it in such a way that it can’t possibly be traced back to Russia?* In fact, you could hire American hackers to do the hacking and intentionally get caught, then once they’re out of prison they move to Russia and get a billion dollars. Indeed, you could find plenty of people who’d be up for that deal for a lot less than a billion dollars. Not that you need some kind of KGB superhackers when you’re dealing with a guy whose password was “p@ssw0rd”. That’s well within the wheelhouse of script kiddies from 4chan /pol/, who want to help Trump even without secret Russian conspiracies and work for free.

      *I am here accepting for the sake of argument that the hackers have been definitively traced back to Russia, even though zero credible evidence of this has been publicly presented and the DNC to this day refuses to give the FBI access to their servers.

      snorlax

      April 5, 2017 at 1:41 pm

      • My theory is that hackers in Russia were Trump supporters because Russian hackers are prole, and the proles love Donald Trump.

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        April 5, 2017 at 2:58 pm

  12. Refresh my memory – has there ever been a scandal in American life where the media didn’t agree to agree that it was such? For example, in 1998 (arguably pre-SJW America) the media agreed Lewinsky was a scandal because a certain subset of democratic voters, 40ish women, actually believed that any man of 50 has an inherent power advantage over a woman of 25, and were thus offended. But absent that dynamic …

    Mel Belli

    April 5, 2017 at 11:26 am

    • “…actually believed that any man of 50 has an inherent power advantage over a woman of 25…”

      The POTUS and an intern? How retarded do you have to be to believe otherwise?

      Jesse

      April 5, 2017 at 11:39 am

    • I was going to say the same. This isn’t a scandal until the media says it is, and they are doing precisely the opposite. This won’t raise the awareness meter a single tick in the public at large. They are still all going hur hur hur, that idiot Drumpf says Obama wire tapped his building, hur hur hur. The Cone of Silence these people live in is astonishing.

      What Trump needs to do is make it unavoidable, and to do that he has to have people arrested. He needs to perp walk Susan Rice and possibly a whole bunch of other insiders. I’d love to see him have an arrest warrant issued for Obama. Would Obama come back from his bum-cation? Doubt it. That’s probably asking too much, but he really needs to have SOMEBODY arrested, and soon.

      peterike

      April 5, 2017 at 1:17 pm

      • Good comment. That’s why the MSM declared the Obama Presidency “scandal free;” because they said so. But they can be pushed into coverage and you’re right; arresting folks is a good way to do it.

        Mike Street Station

        April 6, 2017 at 4:16 pm

  13. OT: Bannon kicked off NSC. There were rumors yesterday that Kushner is trying to get him fired. Not good. It’s the worst-case scenario if the Kushner-Ivanka and Pence-Priebus factions are ganging up on Bannon-Miller; I was hoping for a rather different coalition to emerge.

    snorlax

    April 5, 2017 at 1:45 pm

    • I read that too. Roger Stone has been talking about this. Because he said it on Alex Jones, I didn’t give him any credibility. But what if it is true? I could totally see that happening. Bannon and Miller are the ONLY reason that Trump won. Bannon understands the need to connect with the working classes and focus on trade deals, infrastructure, immigration, development of domestic resources, etc.

      I’ve read behind the scenes that Priebus and Bannon actually do get along but who knows. I’m not so sure about Kushner at this point but it could just be media hyping the story. I have no idea what’s going on.

      Lion – what if it’s true and that some of these Alex Jones conspiracy theories are true? 😦

      JerseyGuy

      April 5, 2017 at 4:52 pm

  14. Mike Cernovich is taking credit for breaking the Susan Rice story. Is that true? I first heard of it on Bloomberg News.

    View story at Medium.com

    Mark Caplan

    April 5, 2017 at 2:51 pm

    • He was the one who reported that Bloomberg and others were sitting on it, and so I would agree that he broke it, though he may not have done the spade work on it.

      gda

      April 6, 2017 at 1:13 am

  15. Even if there is a smoking gun against a liberal/corporate perpetrator it isn’t a smoking gun according to the corporate media. It’s just explained away or buried.

    fakeemail

    April 5, 2017 at 6:08 pm

  16. Regarding the whole Russia thing: It was still individual Americans who voted, even if Russia did spread propaganda. So Democrats are basically saying that Americans aren’t smart enough to decide who to vote for on their own, that they were somehow duped by Russia into voting for Trump. Why would we want to vote for such a party anyway, who thinks we’re not smart enough to make up our own minds?

    Fact Checker

    April 5, 2017 at 9:33 pm

  17. In order to squash rumors the Obama administration was spying on Trump because of Russia, Susan Rice admitted to spying for campaign dirt.

    Dsgntd_plyr

    April 5, 2017 at 11:19 pm


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