Lion of the Blogosphere

Oysters and social class mystery solved?

Raw oysters cut across all social classes. In this way, it’s like NFL football, except the NFL football is a lot more popular than oysters. Not very many people like eating oysters.

I’ve never seen a cooked oyster on a menu in Manhattan, so therefore I assume that cooked oysters are a regional prole dish.

Raw oysters are not in any way trendy, and normally we associate SWPL tastes with trendy stuff. The typical upper-middle or upper class oyster eater is more likely to be from an older generation or a frat type, rather than a hipster or SJW type, and more likely to work in a conservative industry like finance.

Written by Lion of the Blogosphere

June 22, 2017 at 6:33 pm

Posted in Bobos

48 Responses

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  1. Asian food is prole now, from cheap takeout to fancy sushi.

    Jjbees

    June 22, 2017 at 6:51 pm

    • In 2007, SWPLs loved Japan, but now its traditional patriarchal culture triggers too many SJWs, and its unabashedly pro-ethnostate policies bother leftists in general.

      In general, Asian soft power efforts appeal to nerdy white men and horny Turkish guys. You don’t hear SWPLs praise Abe over Merkel.

      I’m in my late 20s and loved anime as a nerdy middle schooler, so the #AnimeRight isn’t just a mere joke. In contrast, leftists my age all love those trite, godawful comic book movies that come out four at a time a year now.

      Sid

      June 22, 2017 at 8:06 pm

    • By the prole/SWPL schema, which category do hipsters fall into?

      Sushi is mainstream now (which might make it prole), but the poke bowl joints in my town definitely attract a hipster clientele. Waiting in line, I’m definitely the odd man out with my structurally intact ear lobes.

      Wency

      June 23, 2017 at 10:16 am

      • Hipsters used to be SWPL, but like sushi, are now prole.

        jjbees

        June 23, 2017 at 7:48 pm

      • I would say most hipsters with college degrees are basically poor SWPLs. They don’t have a lot of spend, so they fashion themselves as being “against consumerism” to mask their economic frailty, but their tastes and desires are SWPL to the core. They ultimately aren’t smart or driven enough to be successful yuppies or even bourgeois Bohemians (bobos).

        There is some gray area, however. The nerdier hipsters, the ones often labelled “manchildren,” do have a strong affinity towards Asia, and nerdiness is a prolish quality (you’re essentially a smart kid who grew up around mediocrities and fools, so you weren’t socialized properly).

        On the other side of the coin, you’ll find plenty of dumb whites on the West Coast who had difficulty graduating from high school and smoke marijuana all day. They’re somewhere between prole and hipster, since they’re still strongly against racism, sexism, homophobia, Islamophobia, etc., but are too rough and uneducated to be genuinely SWPL. They’re the kind of goons who fill up antifa crowds.

        Sid

        June 23, 2017 at 9:29 pm

      • A lot of the opprobrium lobbed at “Bernie Bros” last year was aimed at the prolier hipster kids. Both the nerdier and dumber white male leftists loved Bernie with a burning loyalty. They barked and hissed at the prospect of having to vote for Hillary, whom they knew did not have their interests at heart.

        In contrast, bobos voted for Bernie in the primaries and then voted for Hillary in the general without a moment’s hesitation.

        Sid

        June 23, 2017 at 9:35 pm

  2. good example with the NFL cutting across social classes.

    still not sure about oysters.

    rivelino

    June 22, 2017 at 6:54 pm

    • baseball and sport attendance in general are on the descendant. I’m not sure of oyster consumption.

      JS

      June 23, 2017 at 9:36 am

  3. Blue Ribbon has cooked oysters

    Zack

    June 22, 2017 at 6:56 pm

  4. Oysters taste pretty weird. They’re fine but not my first choice.

    I hope eating mussels isn’t prole. But if it is, let me be prole. I love mussels.

    Sid

    June 22, 2017 at 7:23 pm

  5. The working and middle class do not go to restaurants and order raw oysters. The conservative upper middle and upper class does. They are frat boys and sorority girls all grown up aka Country Club Republicans.

    B.T.D.T.

    June 22, 2017 at 7:25 pm

    • I think this is generally true, though there might be elements of the middle classes that eat them.

      Again, sometimes the definition of “prole” on this board is so expansive that it misses key distinctions. A true prole never orders his steaks less than medium, and many will go so far as well done. I knew a waiter who told me that people at his prole restaurant would often order steaks “extra well”.

      But if we apply the term “prole” to both business executives who order their steaks medium rare and pair it with a Pinot and warehouse employees who order their steaks “extra well with ketchup” paired with a Coke, then I guess a separate term is needed for the latter group.

      Wency

      June 23, 2017 at 10:27 am

  6. Oysters Rockefeller isn’t prole.

    Steve Johnson

    June 22, 2017 at 7:37 pm

  7. I’ve never seen a cooked oyster on a menu in Manhattan, so therefore I assume that cooked oysters are a regional prole dish.

    They should have Oysters Rockefeller.

    The Undiscovered Jew

    June 22, 2017 at 7:38 pm

  8. Oysters are enjoyed by walruses and carpenters alike.

    Jokah Macpherson

    June 22, 2017 at 7:55 pm

    • MEH 0910

      June 23, 2017 at 5:34 pm

  9. From Wikipdea:
    In the early 19th century, oysters were cheap and mainly eaten by the working class. Throughout the 19th century, oyster beds in New York Harbor became the largest source of oysters worldwide. On any day in the late 19th century, six million oysters could be found on barges tied up along the city’s waterfront.
    .
    .
    .

    Eventually, rising demand exhausted many of the beds. To increase production, they introduced foreign species, which brought disease; effluent and increasing sedimentation from erosion destroyed most of the beds by the early 20th century. Oysters’ popularity has put ever-increasing demands on wild oyster stocks.This scarcity increased prices, converting them from their original role as working-class food to their current status as an expensive delicacy.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oyster#Human_history

    Rosenmops

    June 22, 2017 at 8:35 pm

  10. This posting prompts a memory. Over 30 years ago while driving a yellow cab in Manhattan I picked up a TOOS old lady on 5th avenue. She was a very nice old lady. She just started talking, about lots of things. Told me that the only thing that she gave a damn about anymore was her Episcopal church. (When was the last time that you met a proud, authentic old-school Episcopalian? , not these homo ex-Catholic types who join the church so they can get gay-married). She also told me that she remembered the sinking of the Titanic. It was the 9/11 of her day, newspaper hawkers shouting the news on all the old New York street corners. Then she went into a reverie about her father, whom she adored, who, when she was about 12 years old, dropped dead one Saturday night after consuming a plate of bad oysters at their country club out on Long Island. Her father was proto-TOOS, probably a millionaire WASP financier, wouldn’t be surprised if he were a friend of Jay Gould. So it looks like oysters were certainly on the menu of the well-to-do back in olde New York. The oysters were probably plucked directly from the waters of Long Island Sound. In the old days the waters of the Hudson River were chock-full of oysters too, so it is said.

    I love oysters, especially with a light lemon or vinaigrette sauce, but I am nervous about them. They really need a super clean ecosystem to be consumed safely. And I can’t see the point of eating cooked oysters. If you want cooked shellfish, just get baked clams.

    Daniel

    June 22, 2017 at 8:42 pm

    • I knew an old guy from that era, a retired officer and native if DC. He joked about this…oysters were supposed to be good for a man’s libido. It was the closest thing to Viagra back then. Probably didn’t work but worth a try anyway before a hot date.

      Mrs Stitch

      June 23, 2017 at 10:18 pm

      • https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oyster#Nutrition

        Traditionally, oysters are considered to be an aphrodisiac, partially because they resemble female sex organs.[51] A team of American and Italian researchers analyzed bivalves and found they were rich in amino acids that trigger increased levels of sex hormones.[52] Their high zinc content aids the production of testosterone.[32]

        MEH 0910

        June 24, 2017 at 6:51 pm

  11. You can’t find a fried oyster po’boy in Manhattan? It’s a more regional dish as it comes from New Orleans and does have a prole origin, but it’s also the type of sandwich that’s good enough to surpass class. It belongs in the elite sandwich category with notables like the reuben, Cuban, and Philly cheesesteak.

    Aristippus

    June 22, 2017 at 9:58 pm

  12. playing football or baseball were prole in my hometown. soccer and basketball not. when Barbarians at the Gate briefly shows henry kravis (from tulsa) watching football in his manhattan apartment i think this was meant as ridicule.

    Beverly Hills Ninja

    June 22, 2017 at 11:12 pm

  13. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Maestri#Personality

    Maestri’s lack of education and earthy, unpolished manner of speaking made him a frequent subject of humor and ridicule. Maestri’s most famous utterance came when dining with President Franklin Roosevelt on Oysters Rockefeller at New Orleans’ famous Antoine’s Restaurant, when Maestri blurted “How ya like dem erstuhs, Chief?” in his characteristic thick New Orleans accent.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oysters_Rockefeller
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Orleans_English

    MEH 0910

    June 23, 2017 at 2:02 am

  14. When I was a kid, my dad had a boat. For fun, he dropped half a dozen lobster traps off the NH coastline, and we’d pull the traps on Saturday mornings. We caught a few lobsters but also large snails, crabs, and oysters, and cooked and ate all of it.

    E. Rekshun

    June 23, 2017 at 5:27 am

  15. Both the media and the rank and file Left seem to be regarding GA-06 as a moral victory.

    Yglesias wrote the best explanation for why the special elections are good news for Democrats: They show that the Romney voters that Trump lost are sticking with the Dems while the traditional Dems who voted for Trump are willing to go vote for Dem reps.

    Counterpoint: The 3 special elections besides GA-06 were low turnout affairs where the combination of insane Democratic enthusiasm and local issues were enough to cause the Dem candidates to over perform expectations. GA-06 was the only special election that was effectively nationalized and the Dems underperformed Hillary’s margin there by 2.3% even though they were running the type of technocratic centrist that the Dems will need to win suburban whites away from the GOP.

    In 2018, the Dems will be running much more partisan candidates against entrenched Republican incumbents. If the Republicans are able to effectively nationalize the 30 or so seats the Dems are targeting, Republicans should easily be able to hold on to all but ~5 of them while maybe picking up some of the 10 seats that they themselves are targeting. A lot can change between now and the midterms, but right now the Republicans have to be the strong favorite to hold the House.

    There does seem to be some disconnect between the Party and the media/rank and file, however. While the media and the base think that all is well, reports are saying that there are a lot of voices within the Party who want to go back to pretending that they don’t hate white people.

    Otis the Sweaty

    June 23, 2017 at 6:25 am

    • GA-06 was the only special election that was effectively nationalized and the Dems underperformed Hillary’s margin there by 2.3% even though they were running the type of technocratic centrist that the Dems will need to win suburban whites away from the GOP.

      And this was a seat where the Republicans were not caught flat footed like they were in earlier special elections. They fought for the seat as hard as they would in a midterm. When the midterms come next year the Republicans will match the Democrats in campaign resources. If the Democrats can’t improve on Hillary’s margins when the GOP won’t take House seats for granted then the midterms will be a wash for them.

      The Undiscovered Jew

      June 23, 2017 at 7:26 pm

  16. In France everyone has raw oyster in christmas time, but from september to april, it is a conservative people in brasserie who loves it. I used to have one dinner a week with my grand mother with only Foie gras and Oysters (24 each) with white alsatian wine. Aristocrat, bourgeois, ashkenazim, artists, professionals , women who dony want to be fat etc. love oysters. Difficult to like them if you didnt have them as a child !

    Bruno from Paris

    June 23, 2017 at 7:39 am

  17. I ordered some type of oyster dish and a beer at the Plaza Hotel in the mid eighties while visiting NYC as a dumb college kid. I remember being shocked when the bill was $35 which was my spending money for the next few days!

    Heyoka

    June 23, 2017 at 8:25 am

  18. The frequency of oyster bars in Hipster nooks of NYC are probably about the same as the prole nooks in the outer boroughs of Long Island, Staten Island and Upstate.

    JS

    June 23, 2017 at 8:50 am

  19. Another difference between oysters and the NFL: if you happen to dislike oysters no one will consider you a freak and weirdo, or maybe some sort of f@gg0t, and it won’t hold you back in a business career or make it more difficult to have sex with women.

    Peter

    ironrailsironweights

    June 23, 2017 at 10:01 am

  20. I live in Maryland. Prole Marylanders have loved their Chesapeake seafood for generations. It’s a part of the old Maryland identity.

    Dan

    June 23, 2017 at 10:53 am

  21. Oysters were the US snack food before the Hot Dog and so cut across all classes. My guess is this remains so from social momentum.

    Once with the high demand along with lobster they were very cheap. No more.

    rob

    June 23, 2017 at 11:30 am

  22. Finance is not conservative in any meaningful sense. They’re for low-ish taxes, and that’s about it.

    bobbybobbob

    June 23, 2017 at 11:49 am

  23. I was researching why shellfish are considered unclean and came up with this interesting explanation:

    Lobsters are nocturnal bottom walkers and scavengers that scavenge for dead animals and debris on the ocean floor – they are like the vultures of the oceans. Lobsters have even been seen burying dead fish and digging them up a little at a time to eat. Crabs will eat just about anything and are known as professional garbage hunters.

    The Encyclopedia of Aquatic Life tells us that crabs, common shrimp and lobsters all feed off of dead and decaying matter. Therein lies their occupation — they were created to be the cleanup crew for the bottoms of lakes, rivers and oceans. They were not intended to be eaten by human beings. Eating raw or undercooked crabs, crayfish, shrimp or snails puts anyone at risk of a severe parasitic infection.

    Filter feeders

    Closer observation of oysters, mussels, scallops and clams shows us that God also had a very significant purpose for these creatures. They are found in streams, coastal areas and lakes and are considered filter-feeders. They are stationary — meaning they do not go hunting for their food but rather pump large amounts of water over their gills, trapping small pieces of silt, bacteria, viruses and plant debris for their dinner. The International Wildlife Encyclopedia tells us that mussels and other filter-feeders are the ultimate scavengers of the sea. They are the detail cleaners, so to speak. Their role is to purify the water.

    Now, you have to ask yourself, once you really understand the role that these creatures play in their natural habitat, do you still want to eat them? Eating scavengers and filter-feeders is kind of like eating whatever is in your vacuum cleaner bag or septic tank. When scavenger and filter feeders make meals out of dead, decaying material along with pathogenic viruses, heavy metals and nerve toxins and we eat them — we are also eating all that they have eaten!

    http://www.offthegridnews.com/off-grid-foods/gods-dietary-laws-why-pigs-crabs-and-lobsters-are-bad-for-you/

    Eating oysters is gross because they filter everything out of the water, including gross stuff.

    Fact Checker

    June 23, 2017 at 2:31 pm

    • Should say “came across,” as in a came across this on a website.

      Fact Checker

      June 23, 2017 at 2:32 pm

    • By the same logic, one shouldn’t eat mushrooms.

      Thomas

      June 23, 2017 at 4:05 pm

    • This is all ridiculous post-hoc rationalization. Next you’re going to tell me that kosher/halal slaughter rules makes some sort of sense. People all over the world came up with various dumb tribal dietary rules and rituals all the time with no rational basis whatsoever. For some weird reason, certain mid-east tribes have stuck with their stupid rules while every other civilized culture has moved on.

      Pork and filter feeders are perfectly healthy and safe when cooked.

      bobbybobbob

      June 23, 2017 at 4:32 pm

      • Pork is actually the best and the most versatile meat. No wonder even most Jews like pork.

        My Two Cents

        June 23, 2017 at 6:36 pm

    • Filter feeders can concentrate trace nutrients just as they can accumulate trace toxins, a very valuable service. Depends where you get them from.
      With bottom feeders, I imagine ancient dietary prohibitions were against people catching ones right off the town jetty where they were literally living off human feces. Again, depends where you get them.

      Giovanni Dannato

      June 23, 2017 at 11:34 pm

      • They deliberately raise fish in India that can eat human sewage. Perfectly safe to eat if you cook them.

        The idea that crabs or oysters are bad juju is just bronze age malarky. Doesn’t matter if they eat yucky stuff.

        bobbybobbob

        June 24, 2017 at 2:27 am

    • Sounds reasonable, but why do they taste so good?

      E. Rekshun

      June 24, 2017 at 4:53 am

    • What about the danger of eating the oceans apex predators, like tuna and swordfish, where the heavy metals like mercury get more and more concentrated as they travel up each step of the food chain all the way to the top.

      MEH 0910

      June 25, 2017 at 9:04 am

  24. In my middle class neighborhood in the suburbs on the Great Eastern Seaboard I don’t think anyone ate oysters when I grew up there in the ’70s and ’80s. I would have associated it with James Bond films and the “glamorous” life. I was eating in a Spanish restaurant with an older friend of mine (early 60s) last year and he ordered oysters and asked me if I wanted one. I remember the stunned look on his face when I told him I had never eaten one before. He is a former lawyer, so maybe it was/is common in that sort of milieu. It was somewhat slimy, I had the impression it is very nutritious. I don’t really think I would order them again, though I am not against it either.

    The Shepherd

    June 23, 2017 at 5:15 pm

  25. Is Lousiana, and New Orleans prole?
    What about Baton Rouge? Shreveport?

    My sense is that Louisiana used to be very TOOS, but has fallen into proledom after Katrina and never recovered.

    jjbees

    June 23, 2017 at 8:09 pm

  26. There are Victorian era (or earlier) recipes for oyster casseroles. One Christmas eve, my father prepared one from an old recipe used by his extremely upper class grandmother. It was sort of nasty, but father couldn’t get enough of it. We caught him after dinner in the kitchen, scouring out the casserole dish with leftover crusty bread. He loved that stuff. Within an hour, he was in obvious discomfort in the good chair, and shortly after that was reduced to a thrashing mess on the bed, moaning and occasionally outgassing from both ends, loud enough to be heard in the living room. Mother fretted that he might expire but he was able to pull it together for midnight mass, looking just a little wan. My point is, oysters are an upper class food but there’s no way to eat them without looking, acting and occasionally suffering as the proles do.

    Paul Rise

    June 23, 2017 at 10:32 pm

    • MEH 0910

      June 24, 2017 at 6:45 pm


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