Lion of the Blogosphere

ACLU: White Supremacists no longer entitled to all First Amendment rights

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2017/08/16/odd-statement-from-the-aclu-of-california-white-supremacist-violence-is-not-free-speech/

While the ACLU continues to support “peaceful” free speech, the statement implies that the ACLU believes that “white supremacists” are inherently violent and thus not entitled to the freedom to assemble.

One also gets the impression that actual facts (as to whether or not they really are violent) don’t matter. “White supremacist” automatically means violent person. (On the other hand, I do support banning weapons from protests, which needs to be enforced against both protesters and counter-protesters. We’re lucky that, so far, people haven’t started shooting at each other.)

The Jew-hating Daily Stormer website is still off the internet. The Russian internet companies joined the global crackdown. I don’t particularly like Jew-haters, but it’s the beginning of the slippery slope that will eventually lead to blogs like mine being removed from the internet, cheered on by the ACLU.

* * *

And in other news, a 145-year-old statue of Chief Justice Taney in Maryland was spirited away overnight.

How are we any different than ISIS?

Written by Lion of the Blogosphere

August 18, 2017 at EDT am

Posted in Law

50 Responses

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  1. I don’t think it’s quite as bad as you make out although it is deeply concerning. National ACLU said they agreed with the state level statement, but in the text of the National ACLU statement they basically disavow the state level statement.

    The real concern is that the national ACLU will eventually follow the state level approach and abandon free speech. State level views are a leading indicator of the way things are going.

    RSF

    August 18, 2017 at EDT am

  2. I’m surprised by how many people I ping for opinions IRL agree with these crackdowns on free speech. I guess I had too much faith in humanity.

    Jokah Macpherson

    August 18, 2017 at EDT am

    • If I were in power and held all the hands in the deck, I would be a fool to give my enemies/SJW any rights if I didn’t have to. I would applaud a leader who could permanently shut them all down.

      Free speech can only had with fellow citizens of a common culture with broadly similar backgrounds and goals. . .not foreigners and enemies.

      fakeemail

      August 18, 2017 at EDT am

      • Some say tolerate speech from your in-group and suppress that of your enemy through violence and legal and social sanctions, but I say tolerate speech from your enemy as well, and defend the rights of those who hate you. If you only defend the freedom to express opinions you agree with, what’s the point? Doesn’t antifa do the same?

        Jokah Macpherson

        August 18, 2017 at EDT am

      • Jokah wrote, “If you only defend the freedom to express opinions you agree with, what’s the point?” One answer is contained in a post at “Uncouth Reflections,” in this quote of Wikipedia’s entry on Left philosopher/writer Herbert Marcuse’s essay “Repressive Tolerance”:

        “Marcuse believes that under such conditions [liberal democracy], tolerance as traditionally understood serves the cause of domination and that a new kind of tolerance is therefore needed: tolerance of the Left, subversion, and revolutionary violence, combined with intolerance of the Right, of existing institutions of civil society, and of any opposition to socialism… Revolutionary minorities hold the truth and the majority has to be liberated from error by being re-educated in the truth by this minority. The revolutionary minority are entitled, Marcuse claims, to suppress rival and harmful opinions.”

        I don’t know if Charlottesville Mayor Signer or Police Chief Taylor have favorited this essay on Facebook. It would be in the spirit of the times.

        amac78

        August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

  3. The only consolation is that, after they get rid of Confederate statues, we’re going to hear the whining and wailing from the GOPe types when they go after Washington, Lincoln etc.

    And then you’ll see the leftists whining once the right quietly starts getting all the Black Pride murals painted over.

    Sure, the country is doomed, but every one of them will get burnt before that happens.

    Jesse

    August 18, 2017 at EDT am

    • Have you looked at National Review lately? It’s a laugh watching them say that Washington and Jefferson couldn’t possibly be threatened by statue destroyers because there’s a clear line to be drawn between they, who founded the country, and the Confederates who tried to break up. But that line only exists as long as the Confederate statues are around to take the first punches. Once they’re gone, we get new “clear” lines: Washington and Jefferson owned slaves, while Franklin and Hamilton opposed slavery. George and Tom have got to go! It’ll go on and on until we’re tearing down the Alamo and burning the ashes of Davy Crockett a second time.

      Richard

      August 18, 2017 at EDT am

      • I agree with you.

        Auster used to say that NR would oppose a liberal proposal for 5 years. Then they would cave in. And he was absolutely right. It happens time and time again.

        Lewis Medlock

        August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

      • Confederate statues: white slave-owning secessionists!
        Washington and Jefferson: not white slave-owning secessionists… oh wait.

        Recently, in Chicago a statue of Lincoln was defaced and don’t even ask me what that was about.

        Tarl

        August 19, 2017 at EDT am

      • Lincoln had views of blacks what would be considered “racist” by modern standards.

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        August 19, 2017 at EDT am

    • And how soon before House Rs become radicalized? What event will be big enough?

      Curle

      August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

    • while Franklin and Hamilton opposed slavery.

      Neither Franklin or Hamilton are safe.

      They tried to take Hamilton off the $10 bill last year.

      The Undiscovered Jew

      August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

      • Nobody’s safe. Teddy Roosevelt railed against “hyphenated Americans”. FDR put Japanese Americans in concentration camps. Eisenhower booted huddled masses in Operation Wetback. Kennedy casting-couched a girl into performing oral sex on a friend of his while he watched. Carter and Romney were both knowing members of white supremacist churches in the ’70s.

        Social values change so radically over time, particularly on the left, that once you go down the road of blackballing anybody who fails to conform to contemporary moral values (and values of a faction at that) it all must be destroyed unless hypocrisy intervenes.

        Richard

        August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

      • FDR put Japanese Americans in concentration camps. Eisenhower booted huddled masses in Operation Wetback. Kennedy casting-couched a girl into performing oral sex on a friend of his while he watched.

        It will take a long time for FDR to get the eraser but the old Communist spymaster will have his turn eventually.

        The Undiscovered Jew

        August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

      • They already erased FDR’s trademark cigarette-holder from recent statues of him.

        Tarl

        August 19, 2017 at EDT am

    • They backed away from their initial plan to remove Hamilton. But it’s only a matter of time before they try again.

      The Undiscovered Jew

      August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

    • And if they tried to remove Hamilton of course they will go after Washington and Jefferson.

      The Undiscovered Jew

      August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

    • “you’ll see the leftists whining once the right quietly starts getting all the Black Pride murals painted over.”

      This will never happen because the Right are pussies. The Right is too afraid even to try this, but if they did, all the Left would have to do is scream “rayciss!” and the Right would back off.

      Tarl

      August 19, 2017 at EDT am

  4. White people are not entitled to first amendment rights

    27 year old from sailers

    August 18, 2017 at EDT am

  5. It never ceases to amaze me how the MSM just omits any wrongdoing of the antifas, when in fact, it was them who really provoke the protestors who were against the removal of the statue. The entire narrative was that these men were hardcore racists and White Supremacists, and anything harm inflicted on them is worthy of praise or omission of guilt.

    JS

    August 18, 2017 at EDT am

    • Republicans supported the creation of this elite media monoculture for years. It’s yet another example of idiot Republicans thinking they got one over on the democrats because keeping the industry deregulated went along with their so called principles and up held the so called free market. So we got rid of any limits on media concentration, allowing the companies to discriminate against conservatives and conservative constituencies to their hearts content, and all around gave zero consideration to the effect of the media on the wellbeing of the country. And we ended up with this hyper efficient near totalitarian influencing machine (the real version of the thing that Scott Adams is always blathering about). One that is so totally concentrated geographically, economically, culturally, ethnically, and educationally among a tiny group of people who so thoroughly hate republicans and their constituencies that not even the uber rich owner billionaires can hold their nose against the stench of all the republican’s white christian male voters long enough to give any meaningful support to the to the republicans and their billionaire worshipping corporatist and plutocratic platform.

      And even on this site and on steve sailer’s blog people resist any efforts to regulate the media and to treat it as the out of control destructive industry that it is.

      Magnavox

      August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

      • You gotta feel sorry for these 2 dudes – this picture has been plastered all over the media as the night of terror in Charlottesville.

        Their reputation have been forever tarnished, symbolic of Hitler. Imagine trying to get a job, getting a loan or just walking out in public, people will be pointing fingers at them, if they are lucky enough not to take a physical blow.

        JS

        August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

      • yep, the one in the white polo shirt got denounced by his dad

        gm

        August 20, 2017 at EDT pm

  6. Basically, Whites have been surrounded and victimized physically, financially, and demographically and if they simply attempt to say, “knock it off”, all NAMs and SJWs can claim that’s violence and that they no longer feel safe. . .thus giving themselves a carte blanche to (further) knock out nazis.

    The world we live in: whites with a permit who attempt to peacefully protest about legitimate interests swiftly have police attack them and push them into a crowd of criminals. . . and then be called the instigators by the media.

    Non-whites who violently riot over the justified death of a fellow criminal are given space to destroy and vent their highly ilegimate claims without a hair to be touched on their head by police and with the media defending their actions as justified actions of the “underserved.”

    This nightmare is no mistake or big misunderstanding. Those in power, the good Whites and the big Jews, want the bad whites beaten down and living in abject fear and hopelessness and slavery. That is the source of their power and NAMs and SJWs are their pawns. Those in power will broach no dissent or challenge to their power. Anarchy-Tyranny on the nose.

    fakeemail

    August 18, 2017 at EDT am

  7. They got a lot of push back from donors for their original support. So, this isn’t your father’s ACLU. Liberal orthodoxy has no room for free speech so these legacy organizations are either going to change with the times or vanish.

    Mike Street Station

    August 18, 2017 at EDT am

    • I don’t follow the ACLU closely, but I’ve noticed over the last 10 years that people representing them had been sounding much more SJW-y than they did in the past, so this is just formal policy catching up to the people working there.

      Richard

      August 18, 2017 at EDT am

    • 1977 is ancient history to Americans now.

      Horse and wagon, get your water from a well or creek.

      It’s now all internet, dumb phones and less history, less information and less ability to separate emotional threats from critical thinking.

      Rifleman

      August 18, 2017 at EDT am

      • dumbphones! That’s a rhetorical winner.

        Andrew E.

        August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

    • A small number of donors can exert huge influence. For years, David Gelbaum, the same guy who got the Sierra Club to drop its opposition to immigration, donated about 25% of the ACLUs annual operating budget.

      Magnavox

      August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

  8. Good post and comments, mates. I have my views, but you are an island of sanity.

    Yakov

    August 18, 2017 at EDT am

  9. In 1921, the British put up a statue in Trafalgar Square to the British traitor George Washington. I googled who he was. He was an American general in the civil war between Great Britain and her American colony. The statue still stands there even today.

    Mark Caplan

    August 18, 2017 at EDT am

    • Wait till they find out Washington owned Slaves!

      Mike Street Station

      August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

    • Learning from history doesn’t change a darn thing. Statues of the tyrannical Roman Nero were destroyed when he died.

      Perhaps the antifa should head to the Metropolitan Museum of Art with their clubs and start whacking the living day lights of every art piece that is considered Western, especially the Greco-Roman sculptures. The Greeks and Romans practiced slavery.

      Given the security at the museum which is made up of many brown and black folk, they would let these guys in with their sticks. Then talk about a liberal fascist melt down, when the upper echelon White liberals who run the museum start to wonder what made these guys tick.

      JS

      August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

    • Eh that was just the Brits truckling to the Americans who just saved their bacon in WW1.

      Tarl

      August 19, 2017 at EDT am

  10. The greatest episode of racially-motivated murdersin this country in the last 50 years was the Zebra killings in the San Francisco Bay area around 1970, in which whites were targeted by Black Muslim death squads. Defenseless persons such as women and the elderly were favored. Many of the victims were tortured and mutilated before being killed. Over 70 people died! Guess that’s all disappeared down the old memory hole, as Steve Sailer would say. Funny how the MSM never seems interested…

    BTW, a movement toward secession appears to be growing in California. Maybe the Confederacy wasn’t so bad after all.

    Black Death

    August 18, 2017 at EDT am

    • The term ‘memory hole’ comes from 1984

      Magnavox

      August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

  11. People here have short memories. It’s very much your father’s ACLU. There were hissy fits and public resignations after Skokie. The ACLU will survive, or it will split into two factions.

    Freedom of speech is alive and well in the US. Stop the whining.

    “(On the other hand, I do support banning weapons from protests, which needs to be enforced against both protesters and counter-protesters. We’re lucky that, so far, people haven’t started shooting at each other.)”

    Thanks for giving me credit for bitching about this several times. I am not a lawyer, but certainly there is a reasonable argument to revoking permission for people “peaceably to assemble” when you have a credible belief that they have no such peaceful intentions.

    That goes for both sides. And the people fucked up. They knew damn well from July 8 what they were in for.

    And I still don’t know WTF torchlight parades (not assemblies, but parades) with young men shouting “Jew will not replace us!” have to do with peaceful assemblies. Define that one for me, Lion.

    gothamette

    August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

    • Charlottsville wants to replace the monuments and the mayor is jewish. Having said that, the official chant was “You will not replace us.” But a faction of daily stormer types said “jew” instead. They just can’t help themselves. Which is why no one should ever tolerate those guys. Always exclude and ignore them.

      destructure

      August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

    • Peaceful as in there was no violence. Or are you one of these SJWs who thinks that saying mean things is violence?

      DataExplorer

      August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

    • The Democrats are trying to make it de facto illegal to disagree with Democrats. You disagree with them in print in a clever or reasoned way and you lose your job or other means of income (Damore, VDARE.) You disagree with them in a loud, brutish way in person (these neo-Nazi marchers) and their paramilitary irregulars will physically attack you while their uniformed troops (the police) watch on.

      Most people jump at the chance to silence their opponents–look at gothamette and fakeemail above, and the campaign finance reforms we have seen passed by Democrats and accepted by feckless Republicans who might have stopped them. When you look around the world, where there is no free speech, and at how many Americans oppose free speech, it is amazing we have had as much free speech as we had, and sad but perhaps unsurprising that we are losing it.

      Gozo

      August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

    • As the whole gay marriage thing demonstrates, culture and law can change quite a bit in a short amount of time. And the Left really really wants to silence its enemies. So I do not share your confidence although I do think that the legal tradition of free speech will be difficult to dislodge.

      By the way, since you have been around for a while, you probably remember the days when KKK types would have a march and the police would protect them. That seems to be changing. If the police refuse to protect unpopular groups, it’s an erosion of free speech.

      fortaleza84

      August 19, 2017 at EDT am

      • If the police refuse to protect unpopular groups, it’s an erosion of free speech.

        This is a country where the establishment went up the wall over Trump’s opposition to smashing Confederate monuments, despite polling which showed that the respectable, mainstream view had 27% support while Trump, the extremist, represented a meagre 62% of Americans.

        In anarcho-tyranny the popular groups get fucked too.

        Richard

        August 19, 2017 at EDT am

    • “Freedom of speech is alive and well in the US.”

      Ever hear of political correctness? Political correctness dictates that every “controversial” topic is off limits. Try questioning the perceived wisdom on global warming, race, feminism, Islam, globalism, and a couple of dozen others in a public forum and see how committed academia and corporations are to free speech.

      Nat Hentoff was a free speech absolutist and he was highly critical of the ACLU. According to Wikipedia, Hentoff argued that the ACLU supported government-backed speech codes in both universities and the workplace.

      Lewis Medlock

      August 19, 2017 at EDT am

      • Did Nat Hentoff end up in jail? Last I heard, freedom of speech meant that you didn’t go to jail for speaking freely. It didn’t mean that you were popular.

        gothamette

        August 19, 2017 at EDT pm

      • ya, lots of altsperger types think freedom of speech mean they are entitled to high paying jobs and blow jobs for their wokeness

        gm

        August 20, 2017 at EDT pm

  12. Bannon is out, but his point is still a good one: if liberals focus too much on “front page” issues, the median voter will desert them. “Front page” issues, like Charlotesville, the transgender in the army ban, the Muslim ban, etc.) are very attractive to media because they sale ad spaces, and they are very attractive to non-entrenched politicians because it allows them to be on camera more frequently. However, at the end of the day, the majority of voters will always be more concerned about policies that will directly affect them and their families (taxes, economic growth, healthcare, student loans, etc.).

    If the Democrats continue to focus too much on “front page issues” and fail to devote enough time to build a campaign platform that is different from “we are not them,” the median voter will stop caring. Don’t get me wrong. I think Trump is doomed in any scenario, but Trump is not the GOP, especially at the local level, where conservative politicians who know better will start making promises that people will be able to relate to directly.

    trap-n-skeet

    August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

  13. I wish that they’d treat fascists and communists equally.

    That’s all I ask.

    Half Canadian

    August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

    • “I wish they’d treat fascists and communists equally.

      That’s all I ask.”

      That will never happen. The media doesn’t even treat mainstream conservatives and communists equally. They prefer the latter. Hell, it looks like NR is unable to treat fascists and communists equally.

      I would wager that academics and the elite media would prefer Stalin or Mao over Pinochet, or possibly even Nixon. They’re that demented.

      Lewis Medlock

      August 18, 2017 at EDT pm

  14. […] censorship(ex.VDARE targeted by corporate left) Extending the First Amendment to corporations ACLU: White Supremacists no longer entitled to all First Amendment rights Noam Chomsky: Antifa is a ‘major gift to the […]


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