Lion of the Blogosphere

Jewish math and HBD

If Jews (defined as people Jewish enough to make Aliyah to Israel) are 5% of the white U.S. population, and the average Jew scores 2/3 of a standard deviation higher on tests than the average white gentile, and a white person needs to score three standard deviations above the white gentile median on tests to get accepted to the most elite colleges, and everyone applies at the same rate, what percent of white students at the most elite colleges will be Jewish?

The answer is 27.7%. Which comes pretty close to matching reality. There’s no Jewish overrepresentation anywhere if you account for HBD.

If you don’t believe me, duplicate the experiment in Microsoft Excel yourself. You can use the NORMDIST() function to calculate the standard deviation stuff.

Written by Lion of the Blogosphere

December 30, 2017 at 10:15 AM

Posted in Education

79 Responses

Subscribe to comments with RSS.

  1. “the average Jew scores 2/3 of a standard deviation higher on tests than the average white gentile,”

    There’s your problem right there. The applications Harvard is receiving are not coming from any aversge peop!e, except maybe in polevaulting skills.

    Explainer 21

    December 30, 2017 at 10:36 AM

    • I think you may have misunderstood the argument. The post isn’t claiming that Harvard is receiving or accepting applications from average people; the statement “a white person needs to score three standard deviations above the white gentile median [mean]” implies that the model assumes Harvard is accepting people with IQs over around 145 (100 + 3*15). (It’s more conventional to work in terms of the mean than in terms of the median, but for the normal distribution they are the same.)

      The white gentile mean IQ is around 100, with a standard deviation of about 15. If Jews score 110 on average, or 2/3 of a standard deviation above the (white gentile) mean, there are enough of them above +3SDs to account for the ratios seen at elite universities.

      See “Assessing the Ashkenazic IQ” by the inimitable La Griffe du Lion for more analysis in this direction.

      Lex Corvus ♔ (@LexCorvus)

      December 30, 2017 at 8:14 PM

      • 145 is unrealistically high, BTW. There are surely many people with 145+ IQs at Harvard, but there’s no way that’s even the average, much less the floor.

        Lex Corvus ♔ (@LexCorvus)

        December 30, 2017 at 9:22 PM

  2. I think you are missing the essence of Sailer’s complaint. There is no over representation from an HBD perspective, but MASSIVE over representation if you accept the representation premise of Affirmative Action, which all Ivy League schools and the majority of Jewish “intellectuals” in the USA do.

    Being constantly lectured by about how evil and racist they are for being over represented as compared to the general population by 10 or 20 percent in a given college or profession by people who are themselves 500% over represented in the most elite colleges and professions in the country is a tough pill for gentiles to swallow.

    What Sailer is saying to Liberal Jews is that if you believe in AA, then establish quotas at Harvard and Yale that limit the Jewish population to 5 -7% of the undergraduate and graduate populations. And if you aren’t willing to do that, then shut up about all this AA nonsense.

    PerezHBD

    December 30, 2017 at 10:51 AM

    • Liberal Jews believe that blacks score low on the SAT because of discrimination by whites, and when whites score low its because they were too lazy to study. Why should they reward whites for being lazy?

      Lion of the Blogosphere

      December 30, 2017 at 11:24 AM

      • Any idea how many units of discrimination equates to a ten point decline in nature’s intended SAT score? How many times were you slandered or slighted by the guidos and how much did that suppress your natural baseline?

        Curle

        December 30, 2017 at 5:17 PM

      • Honestly, I think it did depress my grades and motivation.

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        December 30, 2017 at 5:48 PM

      • >>Liberal Jews believe that blacks score low on the SAT because of discrimination by whites, and when whites score low its because they were too lazy to study. Why should they reward whites for being lazy?

        Doubtful. We have already established that Jews at elite schools are smart. Smart people wouldn’t accept this ridiculous excuse for Black underachievement

        Daniel

        December 30, 2017 at 11:10 PM

      • In fact they do. Occam’s Razor: Liberals say the stuff they do because they believe it.

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        December 31, 2017 at 12:57 AM

      • >>Honestly, I think it did depress my grades and motivation.

        But you avoided much of the baleful consequences of guido culture when you went to Stuyvesant. Fourteen to eighteen are very formative years, and at Stuyvesant you were surrounded by smart, high achievers. On the other hand, the abuse, senselessness and neglect that you suffered growing up in a prole environment prior to the age of 14 could have left you with some form of post traumatic stress disorder, something that undermined your confidence both in high school and college, and something that may still be affecting you up to this day.

        I grew up in a bullying prole culture too, and it definitely had negative consequences on me, that affect me to this day, but unlike you I could not escape to Stuyvesant during those crucial mid-teen years. I got into good colleges too. Went to an Ivy school, but my prole upbringing left me completely unprepared to take advantage of the educational opportunities offered in college. I just saw college as another obstacle that I had to learn to dodge to move forward in life. I speak this truthfully, the idea of getting an education, to learn something in college was the furthest thing from my mind.

        Daniel

        December 30, 2017 at 11:22 PM

      • Lion: It could have been worse. You could have grown up in Woodside or Sunnyside or a similar Irish enclave. You probably would have endured more torment than you did on Staten Island. Take it from me, the Irish were angrier and rougher than their Italian-American counterparts.

        Lewis Medlock

        December 31, 2017 at 6:40 PM

    • Moreoever, it beggars belief that Asians — who not only score at near Jewish levels but who are applying at much higher rates year after year since the early 1990s would see their percentages at the Ivy League stagnate. There are probably 3x as many Asians applying to HYP today relative to whites and Jews but almost no increase in absolute numbers.

      nohwon

      December 30, 2017 at 6:49 PM

  3. At top colleges, the average math SAT is in the top 1%. The math SAT is only potentially going to disqualify you. You’ll not get in because you scored high SAT scores.

    Zack

    December 30, 2017 at 10:56 AM

    • And in the early 1990s, the SAT was debased so that the elites could play games with admission. Between 1992 and 1994, the number of perfect 1600s increased six fold. Not a random event.

      With math, there are things like the American Math exams and the International Olympiads to find the super elite performers. But by having a lower bar to getting 750 and above, lots of formerly just “pretty good” scorers are treated like top scorers when the Ivies wish it (such as for NAMs and legacies.) That means a smart kid from a good school who isn’t genius (American math team) level but would’ve scored something like a 790 or 800 on the old math test (which was much harder to do) has no way now to signal to top schools that he is really something special.

      Once more, discretion is given to elite universities to decide when to look for “really” strong candidates and those they know merely “look like” other candidates. Lots of wiggle room now.

      In contrast schools like Caltech spend a lot of time figuring out which students in the 750 to 800 range are really good and dedicated. Why? Because unlike HYP, allowing a less qualified student to enter would be murder. As it stands, the average admittee has to struggle just to pass. Those admitted to the bottom third of HYP would have zero chance of graduating in any major at Caltech (since Lit and Business majors still have to pass advanced Calculus, Physics and Chemistry classes without special tracks for non-scientists.) If the Ivy League had no grade inflation between hum and natural science there would be no benefit to letting weaker students in.

      nohwon

      December 30, 2017 at 8:14 PM

      • I used to be a headhunter. Recruited computer programmers. I recall speaking with this dude who got his Masters in Computer Science at Cal Tech. He said the place was other-worldly. You could be sitting in a lecture and some 14 year old genius poses a question to the professor, then he and the professor go off on a disquisition for 15 minutes that nobody else in the class could follow. The experience was deflating, dispiriting and depressing. He thought that he would get his Ph.D at Cal Tech, he said that he was glad to get his Masters and get out.

        Daniel

        December 30, 2017 at 11:31 PM

  4. The weakness in the argument is the “if everyone applies at the same rate.” I am sure that many very smart white gentile students from flyover country go to their state universities.

    Peter

    ironrailsironweights

    December 30, 2017 at 10:56 AM

    • Right, another reason Jews are underrepresented at elite schools because a higher percentage of Jews compared to gentiles WANT to go to those schools.

      Lion of the Blogosphere

      December 30, 2017 at 11:25 AM

      • This may be true. I’ve encountered any number of jews completely obsessed with the pedigree of school their child attends. Whereas even the well off gentiles I’ve known were far more lackadaisical about it.

        toomanyspiders

        December 30, 2017 at 12:09 PM

      • Or why Jews are mainly concentrated in NYC, DC, LA, and now SF. It isn’t coincidental.

        JS

        December 30, 2017 at 12:17 PM

      • How Jewish do you have to be to make aliyah? Presumably, it is a less stringent test than qualifying as Jewish by Orthodox standards.

        PV van der Byl

        December 30, 2017 at 2:13 PM

      • http://www.jewishagency.org/first-steps/program/2016

        If you’re Jewish according to Orthodox Jewish law.

        Or if you’re the spouse, child, or grandchild of someone who is Jewish according to Orthodox Jewish law.

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        December 30, 2017 at 2:35 PM

      • If you are Jewish you benefit from Hive Mind privilege compared to Gentile whites in nearly the same degree as Gentile whites benefit from Hive Mind privilege compared to blacks. For some reason, living around guidos perhaps, you appear to have been raised with, at best, Gentile levels of Hive Mind privilege.

        You are always stronger as a member of a strong group (Hive Mind). I saw this in the late 80s working in a Jewish dominated office (the employer was Jewish) and one of my colleagues, an older woman, had a pretty unimpressive (on a Jewish baseline) son she was working overtime to get into an Ivy. I think she succeeded. I remember her being on the phone asking a friend on the East Coast to find a professor (at Columbia) to write a recommendation sight unseen. I was amazed at the boldness. I didn’t ask my parents to do anything except loan me some money and they would have been fine with me attending a flagship state U whether it was a top one or not. It was my prep school advisor who picked my college for me.

        Curle

        December 30, 2017 at 5:40 PM

  5. Three standard deviations above the white gentile mean IQ is right around 145. Claiming an IQ of 145 is the floor, or even the average (but your verbiage indicates you believe it to be the floor) for getting accepted into the Ivy League is preposterous. An IQ of 145 would put you into the top quartile at any Ivy League school. Realistically, the floor for getting in without special advantages like race or athletics is somewhere around 125 although your odds obviously increase from there with additional IQ. I’m not going to bother pulling up a Z-score chart but Jews probably make up somewhat less than 10% of all whites with IQs >125.

    Also, the Jewish percentage of whites at the Ivy League is well above 25%. Try closer to 50%.

    WangHu?

    December 30, 2017 at 11:31 AM

    • “I’m not going to bother pulling up a Z-score chart but Jews probably make up somewhat less than 10% of all whites with IQs >125.”

      Well that’s why you should use the chart, based on the assumptions in the post, 15%.

      “Also, the Jewish percentage of whites at the Ivy League is well above 25%. Try closer to 50%.”

      I attended Penn, the second-most Jewish Ivy, and no way were half the whites there Jewish. Don’t believe all the bullshit you read on anti-Semitic websites.

      Lion of the Blogosphere

      December 30, 2017 at 11:36 AM

  6. Yeah, as I pointed out in an earlier thread, the bar is higher for Jews unless you are willing to leave Nassau or Westchester Counties and move to Kootenai or Glacier.

    Of course in analyzing the discrepancy, one needs to keep in mind that the demand for Ivy League education among Jewish families far exceeds that of your typical Gentile family in the United States. I’m very confident that if you measured that factor and added it to the analysis, it would confirm that elite colleges discriminate against Jews.

    As a side note, I would have no objection at all if elite colleges implemented a strict “no Jews” policy. If that happened, then within a generation schools like Rutgers, SUNY, the Technion, etc. would rival places like Harvard and Yale in terms of prestige. And would be a lot cheaper to boot.

    fortaleza84

    December 30, 2017 at 11:31 AM

    • Once upon a time, City College in New York did rival Ivies. In the 1930s to 1950s, City College was known as the poor man’s Harvard. But then Ivies started taking more Jews, Jews got richer, and City College went open admissions because it was sued by “civil rights” groups.

      Lion of the Blogosphere

      December 30, 2017 at 11:38 AM

      • The main campus of City College is very nice. I just love riding the IRT 1 line where it stops at Columbia then travels up north to NAM land where the CC campus is located. I guess the NAMs and the CC students riding the train resent seeing a flock of SWPLs and East Asians step off the station that reads “Columbia University”.

        JS

        December 30, 2017 at 12:53 PM

      • The kids getting off for City College are more Asian than at Columbia.

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        December 30, 2017 at 1:24 PM

      • I see a lot of Hispanics and a few blacks, not many East Asians getting off at the CC station when I used to travel up to the Hispanic Society (which is an institution founded by Samuel Huntington dedicated to the study of Iberian history and culture and it’s also a museum).

        JS

        December 30, 2017 at 1:29 PM

      • City College is reported to be 25% Asian, but Asians prefer Baruch because they think they will learn practical skills like “business” so they can then earn high wages.

        Coming from a prole family myself, I understand that kind of thinking. Majoring in liberal arts seemed weird and crazy to me when I was 18.

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        December 30, 2017 at 1:36 PM

      • lots of prole south asians i grew up with in corona, jackson heights, etc ended up going to city college

        gm

        December 30, 2017 at 2:04 PM

      • HYP is very liberal arts oriented, and liberal arts phobic, East Asians view them as discriminatory, because they want to get in and are refused. Again, what is their beef with this discrimination?

        JS

        December 30, 2017 at 2:12 PM

      • The CC campus is very nice, but much of the student demographic and the neighborhood demographic don’t reflect it.

        JS

        December 30, 2017 at 2:51 PM

      • >>The main campus of City College is very nice.

        The campus is run down and the library is shit. When you enter the main building there is always some loud rap or “soul” music blasting over the loudspeakers. The nicest facility at City College is the cafeteria.

        The library is almost useless for study because NAMs are always jabbering loudly in groups and yelling across the rooms. They also scrawl nonsense graffiti on the walls and desks and leave trash and food litter all over the place.

        There are some good things going on at City College. SAT scores have been rising. It’s engineering department is fine. It has the Sophie Davis 6 year combined college/med school degree and the latest enhancement is the Macaulay Honors college, which is part of City College but which has its own social and study facilities, as do certain programs such as the bio-engineering program.

        If a little bit more money is thrown at City College and NAMS would learn to behave more respectfully to their fellows, City College could be a very good institution.

        Daniel

        December 30, 2017 at 11:44 PM

  7. Meh. There is a line of discussion that Jewish left intellectuals began jimmying IQ/SAT tests in the 50’s to discriminate for them (verbal criticism instead of deep understanding)/certain minorities (rote math, favoring certain Asian languages given how they describe numbers) and against regular US West Euros–then discriminating for their far-left compatriots in academia and business (via regulations) to create a self-justifying echo-chamber. The tests are certainly different, and I would like to see more research.

    I’ve long since given up being amazed at the superficial ‘whataboutism’ thinking and lack of cultural background/jumping to conclusions/re-packaging other’s achievements of many ‘high IQ’ left Jewish academics, Ivy-league level journalists, Nobelists, and MD’s. They’re more PR clever that intelligent in such cases, good at being obsessed on one thing and randomly developing implications missing the big picture. Somewhat like the drumbeat of ‘achievements’ and jimmied tests of the old USSR, to look at another culture.

    Robert

    December 30, 2017 at 11:36 AM

    • “There is a line of discussion that Jewish left intellectuals began jimmying IQ/SAT tests in the 50’s to discriminate for them”

      Yeah, that’s the same bullshit they say about black test scores, they score lower because racist whites intentionally rigged the tests to be “biased” against blacks. It’s HBD denialism.

      If you want more research, read Arthur Jensen’s book Bias in Mental Testing.

      Lion of the Blogosphere

      December 30, 2017 at 11:43 AM

      • Thanks. I think the argument is the tests now favor Blacks somewhat.

        Robert

        December 30, 2017 at 11:52 AM

      • Lion, stop mentally raping these anti-semitics!😂😂

        GondwanaMan

        December 31, 2017 at 3:58 PM

  8. On a related note, something my Black friends are increasingly unhappy about is Jews are 1% of the US population but 10% of legislatures (give or take) but the population proportions are the reverse.

    No SAT/IQ test there, simply political representation. Where are the Sammy Davis Jr. ‘s when we need them?

    Robert

    December 30, 2017 at 11:43 AM

    • People who are Jewish enough to make Aliyah to Israel are more like 3.5% of the population and 5% of the white population.

      Lion of the Blogosphere

      December 30, 2017 at 11:46 AM

      • I see your point, though I wonder if Francisco Franco could probably have met Aliyah.

        American Jewish Yearbook (if I remember correctly) doubled its estimate from 1% to 2% recently. This was criticized as including possible Jews who didn’t identify as Jewish. Brandeis had a study that 5%-7% were of Jewish descent, but that’s too broad a category, though probably looking at something on the right track. Sigh. Whataboutism.

        Robert

        December 30, 2017 at 12:05 PM

      • People who are Jewish enough to make Aliyah to Israel are more like 3.5% of the population and 5% of the white population.

        And you are assuming all of these people have the same IQ edge as pure Jews?

        James B. Shearer

        December 31, 2017 at 2:49 AM

      • No, that’s why I gave the group a 2/3 SD advantage. Pure Jews might have a 1 SD advantage.

        However, Arthur Jensen says that g is a dominant trait, and furthermore, because of assortative mating, gentiles who marry Jews would be smarter than the average gentile.

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        December 31, 2017 at 9:12 AM

    • From a HBD perspective, the sociopathic nature of blacks isn’t suited for politics. Similarly, and inversely, politics in East Asia is that of bureaucracy and nothing else. Western politicians are in another dimension. Flamboyant orators with high future time orientation, full of glib, deceit and lies, while trying to keep a lid on things.

      JS

      December 30, 2017 at 12:07 PM

  9. This doesn’t explain relative asian underrepresentation compared to jews unless you assert jews are scoring a lot higher than asians.

    Going by your logic, there is asian underrepresentation based on HBD.

    anon

    December 30, 2017 at 12:02 PM

    • The elite schools discriminate against the Asians.

      Lion of the Blogosphere

      December 30, 2017 at 1:13 PM

      • Lion,

        But, you see, this is all beggaring the question.

        If Jews are over-represented in the Ivy League, and the Ivy League is discriminating against Asians, then it is the Jews who are discriminating against the Asians.

        And if Jews can engineer Asian discrimination, what makes you think they are not engineering White discrimination?

        You can make the case that this sort of argument is the one the blacks use except for one little problem: it’s demonstrable that blacks can’t build advanced civilizations. Left to their own devices, they built Africa to a stone-age level. Whereas whites carved powerful globe-spanning empires on several occasions and that much of the modern world over the last 800 years was built by whites, including the culture and the technology. It’s obvious, then, that stone-age savages are simply not going to do well on standardized tests of intelligence on average and that they will get the result that you see.

        Jews also do not have a demonstrable history of advanced civilization, outside of the Old Testament and Ancient Historical kingdoms, like Israel. By Lion’s own standards, much of this ancient history is probably half-legend anyway. Yet, the Jews seem to operate as an ethno-nepotistic network that looks out for and favors its own members: a nation within a nation. Do you honestly think that no one is going to try to use this network to leverage advantages against the more atomistically organized? It strains credulity that this won’t happen, especially since any smart person recognizes that two heads are better than one.

        See, the biggest flaw with the over-representation argument due to HBD is that, when you are “over-represented” then that means that you are “in charge.” And, when you are in charge, then you are ultimately responsible, especially when there are results out-of-line with the norm. You can’t have it both ways, being over-represented in most things yet responsible for nothing.

        The solution is to run your tribe as ethnically-nepotistic as the Jews do.

        Or, just have nationalism.

        map

        December 31, 2017 at 12:08 AM

      • “Yet, the Jews seem to operate as an ethno-nepotistic network that looks out for and favors its own members”

        It’s bullshit, no network like that has ever helped me or done any favors for me.

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        December 31, 2017 at 1:02 AM

      • Lion,

        “It’s bullshit, no network like that has ever helped me or done any favors for me.”

        And I believe you. Such a “nation within a nation” will default to class, family and ethnic lines, much the way German Jews often looked down on Eastern European Jews, or rich Jews will look down on poor Jews. Just like regular nations routinely sh*t out the bottom percentages of their people, I have no doubt that all Jews don’t benefit equally from this ethnic nepotism either and that sizeable percentages of Jews lose out.

        Which is why some of these end up in the Alt-Right. And also why the upper class Jews end up among the Gentile elites.

        map

        December 31, 2017 at 1:11 AM

  10. Another factor is e.g. Harvard has limited space, far less than people realize, and they want to have a diverse class (as in many connections) for their students (especially legacy) as a big selling point.

    Ivy League-levels are to some extent a matching service for bright rich kids and truly genius kids in need of dough/up-and-comers from US allies/frenemies. Many Jewish families have their stuff together so obviously will be favored, as will those of rising nations as China or the African ones, one way or another, plus women now that the ladies’ colleges are out of style. Sailer in other words doesn’t get the Yenta function or point of these institutions, and their enemies in the bureaucracy wielding civil rights statutes get the point all too well…

    Plus who cares? The kids of Harvard graduates rarely attend Harvard. Their families don’t need it.

    Robert

    December 30, 2017 at 12:16 PM

  11. Lion, how do you think assuming Z=3 for a thresholdis reasonable? If that were true what do you think a mean would be? Let’s take Z of 3.5, meaning top 0.02%. Total IVYs enrollment is ~ 120,000. So the total number of students below this threshold rate is 120,000/0.0002 = 600,000,000 or twice larger than the US total population. The absurd result unequivocally means that the starting assumption must be wrong.

    Try the much more realistic threshold of 2SD.

    mapman

    December 30, 2017 at 12:25 PM

    • With 2SD and other assumptions the same, 17.4% of whites would be Jewish.

      Lion of the Blogosphere

      December 30, 2017 at 1:18 PM

      • Correct. Anywhere between 10 and 20% is probably reasonable. Depends on assumptions and specific circumstances. Now, 7.7% of Harvard Class 2021 says that their religion is Jewish: http://features.thecrimson.com/2017/freshman-survey/lifestyle/
        Protestants are at 15.9%, Catholics are at 19.5%, atheists + agnostics are at 37.8%. Let’s assume that Jews are about as likely as others to be non-religious (as a first approximation, it’s a reasonable assumption). Which means that Jews are around 10.6% of Harvard’s class of 2021. For comparison, Hillel gives number of 12% (http://hillel.org/college-guide/list/record/harvard-university). The same Harvard survey says that students identifying as white are at 52.1%: http://features.thecrimson.com/2017/freshman-survey/makeup/
        So by this measure the Jews are ~ 20% of whites in Harvard Class of 2021.

        mapman

        December 30, 2017 at 2:41 PM

      • What doesn’t make sense is that there are more Catholics than Protestants.

        There are a lot of Christians who don’t know they are protestant, maybe even Harvard students aren’t smart enough to know they are Protestant and they check the “Other” box?

        Maybe Protestants are more likely to be atheist or agnostic than Catholics?

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        December 30, 2017 at 3:21 PM

      • What doesn’t make sense is that there are more Catholics than Protestants.

        Probably this: the entire 10% of the class that is Latino claims to be Catholic.

        mapman

        December 30, 2017 at 4:19 PM

      • “Probably this: the entire 10% of the class that is Latino claims to be Catholic.”

        Wrong, only 41.7% claim to be Catholic

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        December 30, 2017 at 5:45 PM

      • >>What doesn’t make sense is that there are more Catholics than Protestants.

        I believe that many intelligent Protestants have been made to feel ashamed of their Protestantism, so they deny or eschew it. They are the ultimate white bogey man. They have been told for generations that WASPs have been the source of all evil in America. Even savage white Catholics like wild Guidos and Irish trump them in the oppressor/victim game. Because their ancestors were so evil, increasingly, white Protestants have been made to feel like America’s losers, while the truth is contrary. Where the f**k would we be without the efforts of white Protestants in the past and even today?

        Daniel

        December 30, 2017 at 11:55 PM

  12. a major advantage of prole upbringing: fewer annoying family gatherings, because poor parents want you gone

    grey enlightenment

    December 30, 2017 at 1:46 PM

    • When I was a kid, Manhattanites had minuscule families, with at most two children. Maybe due to the small size of apartments, or to liberalism and atheism. No large family gatherings in the picture, neither in our family nor those of our neighbors.

      Anthony

      December 30, 2017 at 6:16 PM

  13. If you look at it in terms of cognitive ability there is also no under-representation of blacks and Hispanics either. The problem is that the left pretends that IQ does not exist and therefore concludes that the low numbers of blacks and Hispanics at elite schools is the result of racism and not low cognitive ability.

    Joe Walker

    December 30, 2017 at 3:26 PM

  14. Quote: “What doesn’t make sense is that there are more Catholics than Protestants.”

    Why? Many of the southerners that you look down upon are actually Protestants such as Southern Baptists, Episcopalians, one of the smartest Protestant denominations, only make up about 3% of the population.

    Joe Walker

    December 30, 2017 at 3:30 PM

    • Protestants outnumber Catholics in the United States by more than 2-to-1. I expected that at Harvard. Especially when you consider that Catholics are usually prole Italians and Irish.

      Lion of the Blogosphere

      December 30, 2017 at 3:36 PM

      • Hispanics are disproportionately catholic. If Hispanics make up 14% of the class (I saw some data on this the other day) probably at least 10 percentage points are catholic. That would mean white catholics are under 10% of Harvard.

        And you have a very outdated view of white catholics. The high end suburbs of NYC, philly, even atlanta are full of white catholics. On wall street there are tons. Plus white catholics are more concentrated in urban areas which other discussions have suggested are overrepresented at the ivies.

        Nils anders

        December 30, 2017 at 4:27 PM

      • But, Protestants are increasingly not urban dwellers and Catholics have traditionally been urban dwellers and still are as far as I know. And urban dwellers seem to take college ranking more seriously. Good ‘Ol boys are happy enough with LSU.

        “And college men from LSU
        Went in dumb. Come out dumb too
        Hustlin’ ’round Atlanta in their alligator shoes
        Gettin’ drunk every weekend at the barbecues”

        Rednecks, Randy Newman (1974).

        Curle

        December 30, 2017 at 6:16 PM

      • But where are the Protestants? They are mostly southerners such as the Baptists and Evangelicals.

        Joe Walker

        December 30, 2017 at 10:31 PM

  15. Lion I did this math, but in reverse engeneering, to estimate the IQ of medal fields , bank of Sweden economy prizes and physics novel prizes. As Jewish are since one century – and despite Shoah – 1% of white people, and imagining their IQ was 1 sd above white mean, taking their % (32 economy, 30 math, 28 physics) , what is the IQ of novel prize : 152, 150, and 148).

    But for college it doesn’t work because average Is is much lower : Harvard takes 10% of highest SAT scorers but only 1% of most intelligent because average IQ is 125-130. So if Harvard took IQ , and Jewish still had a +1sd IQ, they would be over represented .

    But that’s false . You can see it in the shrinking number of Jewish in the top 100 in Putnam competition or math Olympiad. Exogamy has destroyed Jewish supra-intelligence while reinforcing legacy advantage .

    Bruno

    December 30, 2017 at 6:35 PM

    • The Jews have probably figured out that these Putnam Competitions and Math Olympiads are all bs anyway. These are just cram sessions, memorizing the standard answers to the all the questions. Basically, the math equivalent of a spelling bee.

      It’s like the Westinghouse Prize for high school kids. Isn’t it obvious that the parents do the work? Or, do you really think high school kids are doing graduate-level in the sciences and engineering?

      This rampant Asian fraud is everywhere.

      map

      December 31, 2017 at 12:26 AM

      • No the median Putnam score is 0 or 1 out of 120. The top 1% scores 40 or more. Top 5 goes from 75 to 100 on average . Many young laureates ends up being top university professors or even field medal . Math Olympiad and Putnam have a great predictive power . You are completely wrong .

        Bruno

        December 31, 2017 at 3:56 AM

  16. The Jews have probably figured out that these Putnam Competitions and Math Olympiads are all bs anyway. These are just cram sessions, memorizing the standard answers to the all the questions. Basically, the math equivalent of a spelling bee.

    I don’t think so. Of course I am biased because I did well on those tests.

    James B. Shearer

    December 31, 2017 at 2:52 AM

  17. The answer is 27.7%. Which comes pretty close to matching reality. There’s no Jewish overrepresentation anywhere if you account for HBD.

    Perhaps. But there would still be less if some of the jewish affirmative action burden weren’t being shifted to gentiles.

    destructure

    December 31, 2017 at 4:53 AM

    • The burden is being shifted to Asians, not white gentiles. Without quotas, there’d be even more Asians at Harvard than there already are.

      Lion of the Blogosphere

      December 31, 2017 at 9:17 AM

      • Thomas Espanshade analysed admissions data from highly selective universities and found no evidence of an asian quota. You’re trying to deflect criticism by hiding behind asians.

        You have no problem bashing guidos, proles, religion, etc. But you just can’t concede any criticism of jews (unless it’s orthodox jews) no matter how well-founded. That’s actually kind of sad.

        destructure

        December 31, 2017 at 10:37 AM

      • The problem is that commenters are truly anti-Semites, they ONLY criticize Jews and never anyone else. The alt-right needs to be cleaned up of the Jew haters. And then it becomes anti-Semitic when they criticize ALL Jews and not just the Jews who are part of the liberal alliance that includes gentiles.

        Criticizing guidos: Yes, I criticize guidos, NOT Italians. Guidos can be other ethnicities besides Italian, even Jewish. A guido can stop being a guido, proles can stop acting prole, dumb religious people can stop being religious in a dumb way, but a Jew can’t stop being a Jew (at least how anti-Semites view Jews, actualy Orthodox Jews believe Jews stop being Jews if they start worshipping Christ).

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        December 31, 2017 at 10:56 AM

      • But there would still be less if some of the jewish affirmative action burden weren’t being shifted to gentiles.

        Jews aren’t the only white subgroup that has an above 100 IQ, you hypocrite.

        Scores of Unitarian and Episcopalian SAT takers equates to them having IQs of around 108-110.

        Which means that WASPs are also “shifting the affirmative action burden” onto other more average white subgroups but not one is complaining about high IQ Unitarians or Episcopalians.

        The Undiscovered Jew

        December 31, 2017 at 2:56 PM

      • The burden is being shifted to Asians, not white gentiles.

        In practice, the most intelligent white gentiles are also “shifting the burden” of affirmative action onto less intelligent white gentiles. White Unitarians and Episcopalians have IQs of 108-110 judging by their SAT scores.

        The Undiscovered Jew

        December 31, 2017 at 2:58 PM

      • Leon — “The problem is that commenters are truly anti-Semites, they ONLY criticize Jews and never anyone else.”

        My argument was undeniable. Yet, instead of simply conceding the point, you threw a fit with multiple posts howling about “anti semites”.

        “Criticizing guidos: Yes, I criticize guidos, NOT Italians. Guidos can be other ethnicities besides Italian, even Jewish.”

        I know a jewish guy who’s pentecostal. But when people talk about pentecostals they’re not talking about jews.

        ***
        “Jews aren’t the only white subgroup that has an above 100 IQ, you hypocrite.”

        Never said they were. In fact, if you search for “Affirmative action is the system whereby rich whites favor rich blacks while pretending to help poor blacks and sticking it to poor whites” you’ll find I’ve made that point before. I’ve actually made it numerous times though for some reason it only shows up once. I’ve also referenced Espenshade’s research numerous times showing that, controlling for other factors, similarly qualified working class whites have the lowest rates of acceptance.

        “When lower-class whites are matched with lower-class blacks and other non-whites the degree of the non-white advantage becomes astronomical: lower-class Asian applicants are seven times as likely to be accepted to the competitive private institutions as similarly qualified whites, lower-class Hispanic applicants eight times as likely, and lower-class blacks ten times as likely.”

        But why do similarly qualified lower class whites have lower acceptance rates? Well, obviously, they’re being bumped to make room for blacks, hispanics and asians. But they’re also being bumped to make room for upper class whites. Anyone who’s read my comments on this blog for any length of time has heard me make these points. Had that been the topic then I might have made those points this time as well. But it wasn’t the topic. The topic was jewish admission rates. And when you and Leon were confronted with a sound argument you couldn’t refute you threw tantrums and resorted to ad hominem. In fact, the last time we had this discussion you called me an “anti semite” and “nazi” for make the same argument which you apparently just used in your last comment. There’s plenty of hypocrisy in this discussion but it’s not mine.

        destructure

        January 1, 2018 at 9:49 PM

      • My argument was undeniable. Yet, instead of simply conceding the point,

        Either don’t be such a snowflake when you get caught in your lies or don’t make them in the first place.

        Why should he concede to such an obvious lie by such an obvious troll like you?

        You know perfectly well nobody obsessively points out the fact Slavs were a majority of the Russian Revolutionary leadership. Half the time they say there were no or almost no Slavs at the top, which would come as a great surprise to the Iron Felix, Kropotkin, and Schliapnakov.

        If I’m wrong, point to me the website where that’s mentioned obsessively rather than say you know of one but don’t have the time or “can’t find it for some reason”.

        What Lion said is entirely true, and he ought to ban you for lying about it. Not for being an antisemite per se, but because you waste time clumsily lying in slimy, indirect ways before you do an about face when you get caught as Lion just caught you.

        Never said they were.

        Another example of you not only lying but exposing you’re just too mediocre, weak, vain, and insecure an individual to make this falsehood trolling into a challenge.

        The point is you never single out (in the same way you single out Jews) higher intelligence gentile subgroups such as Unitarians and urban gentiles also distribute the “affirmative action” burden onto more average whites.

        Your lack of interest in the burden New England Episcopalians are putting on white Appalachian college students is so glaring that I’ll bet Lion will say “antisemites single out only Jews for shifting the AA burden onto average whites”.

        After which you’ll lie and say you always singled Episcopalians as often as you did Jews.

        You are a giant pussy.

        “Affirmative action is the system whereby rich whites favor rich blacks while pretending to help poor blacks and sticking it to poor whites”

        Interesting and irrelevant because it’s not what you said. And I’m joking about “interesting”.

        You only said Jews were “shifting the AA burden onto gentile whites”, not discussing whether it favored rich or poor whites.

        I’ve also referenced Espenshade’s research numerous times

        And every time you use it is when discussing Jews as well as dodge answering the fault I pointed out with it because you have no balls:

        Espenshade’s work is faulty (at least as far as it concerns Jews) because he doesn’t account for the fact half of Jewish students are half-Jews – this leads to him overcounting Jewish representation (i.e. the population of full Jews and partial Jews is greater than the fully Jewish population).

        http://www.hillel.org/about/news-views/news-views—blog/news-and-views/2004/01/21/jewish-students-involved-connections-vary

        The NJPS data reveal that the college-age Jewish population is almost evenly split between those who have two Jewish parents (48 percent) and those who have only one Jewish parent (45 percent).

        The Undiscovered Jew

        January 1, 2018 at 11:13 PM

  18. Lion, you went wrong when you classified your second group as “White gentile”. “White gentiles” can be as different in IQ as are different races. Anglos are not Germans are not Poles are not Ukranians are not Irish.

    Of course, Harvard doesn’t keep statistics on which “white” group it derives its gentile white students from, and so the entire analysis is mostly unworkable. Though, I could make some fairly accurate, I would venture, educated guesses.

    Sam

    January 5, 2018 at 10:00 PM


Comments are closed.

%d bloggers like this: