Lion of the Blogosphere

Abortion at SOTU

To defend the dignity of every person, I am asking the Congress to pass legislation to prohibit the late-term abortion of children who can feel pain in the mother’s womb.

As I’ve pointed out before, it’s bullshit that anti-abortion people believe that abortion should be left up to the states. That’s only something they say when they are talking about the Supreme Court. In fact, we see it’s exactly the opposite, anti-abortion people are outraged that one state chooses to have a more liberal abortion policy than most other states. They really don’t want to leave the issue up to the states.

Trump made a mistake putting this into his speech. Trump should try to de-escalate abortion as a political issue. As I’ve previously pointed out, the majority of adults in key swing states ae pro-choice. Also, abortion is beneficial for society Those who insist otherwise are falling for the just world fallacy. Someone has been giving him bad advice.

As I’ve written before:

Whenever I point out the benefits of abortion in reducing the birthrate of the poorest and thus most-crime-prone Americans, they go crazy and refuse to believe it. They insist on believing that every woman who has an abortion is like Juno, a young white girl from a middle-class or better family. Juno is a fictional movie! The reality is that the typical woman who has an abortion is a poor unmarried black or Hispanic woman who already has children. The last people you want to have more children. There is no better government money spent than the money spent on providing free abortions and free birth control for poor people. Every dollar spent on abortion and birth control for poor women saves at least ten dollars, if not a hundred dollars, on welfare, education, and law enforcement for the children those poor women would otherwise have had.

Pro-choice is pro-working-class white.

Written by Lion of the Blogosphere

February 6, 2019 at EST am

49 Responses

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  1. Trump is fighting a competing morality war with Ds who have been painting him as immoral since day one. It is necessary and smart.

    Curle

    February 6, 2019 at EST am

    • Liberals believe that restriction abortion is immoral.

      Lion of the Blogosphere

      February 6, 2019 at EST am

      • Doesn’t matter what ‘liberals’ think. All political wars now are drama wars. The Ds have been playing the drama (movie association) card to the max with Nazis, Supremacists and everything else. Abortion is one of those areas that, even without film or TV representation, is easily put into a visual and dramatic context and thus capable of maximum demonization. The RyanRomney’s never understood this. What you saw last night if you watched the SOTU was Trump showing he is a master of weaving drama and politics in a way the Rs haven’t seen since at least Reagan. That’s big, and abortion is a good dramatic tool for the drama toolbox.

        Drama, the only thing that matters.

        Curle

        February 6, 2019 at EST am

      • Even most Dems find the idea if 3rd trimester abortion appalling. We are talking about killing a baby that could survive outside the womb. That Virginia governor described how even a baby that is already born at full term can be “aborted”. He is probably referring to babies with severe disabilities but he didn’t say that. The law doesn’t say that.

        If a mother gives birth by herself and throws a live baby in a dumpster, she is charged with murder. But in New York it is ok for a mother to give birth in a hostpital and have an “abortion doctor” kill the baby right after birth.

        Can you not understand that even most liberals are horrified by this?

        Rosenmops

        February 6, 2019 at EST am

      • Nobody is going to stand by infanticide, if that is what is being discussed.

        Lowe

        February 6, 2019 at EST pm

      • “Even most Dems find the idea if 3rd trimester abortion appalling. We are talking about killing a baby that could survive outside the womb.”

        Agreed. I have repeatedly referenced stats in the past which explain this issue. The public is roughly divided between pro-life and pro-choice. Half the pro-life people do not want to ban abortion for rape, incest. mother’s health, etc. And since they would never support committees to oversee which abortions meet those criteria, they are effectively supporting abortion on demand for the first 20 weeks. On the other hand, half the pro-choice people oppose late term or partial birth abortion.

        So half the population basically holds the same views regardless of whether they describe themselves as pro-life or pro-choice. While only 25% of the population wants to ban abortion outright and only 25% wants to allow late term or partial birth abortion. That means 75% of the population opposes banning abortion outright but that 75% support banning late term abortion.

        Trump did not make a mistake by putting this in his speech. He just made a core constituency very happy while taking a position 75% of the public agrees with anyway.

        destructure

        February 6, 2019 at EST pm

      • “Even most Dems find the idea if 3rd trimester abortion appalling”

        That’s true. But the average voter knows that the Republicans don’t want to stop at 3rd trimester abortions, just as he knows the Democrats don’t want to stop at banning assault rifles.

        Tanturn

        February 6, 2019 at EST pm

  2. Abortion might be a net benefit to society were it. It for the fact that the aborted babies are being replaced by people who are poorer, and even more prone to criminality. Stop immigration and you may have an argument. Otherwise we’re just engineering our replacement which is already translating into an electorate with a room temperature IQ.

    David

    February 6, 2019 at EST am

    • That’s a separate and orthogonal issue. Abortion breaks my heart, but it’s believable it has a eugenic effect, regardless of immigration levels, or the quality of immigrants.

      Lowe

      February 6, 2019 at EST pm

    • That might be true, but most people consider infanticide an abomination.

      George

      February 8, 2019 at EST pm

  3. I personally think free, no questions asked, easily available, government funded abortions would be of huge benefit to society. But I’m not sure its stupid of him to bring up abortion. He’s specifically trying to call attention to the legalization of some later term abortions in New York that has really gotten the pro-life people riled up.

    Even though most Americans support abortion, the single issue voter contingency probably falls on the pro-life side. And going after later term abortions probably doesn’t scare average people as much as trying to ban them completely.

    The State of the Union was a success with viewers, and its infuriating watching the media reaching and reaching to find ways to negatively spin it.

    Alex

    February 6, 2019 at EST am

  4. The most concise statement of the correct position: I’m pro-life for white babies and pro-abortion for everyone else.

    Karl D

    February 6, 2019 at EST am

    • There is too much white privilege already so white peopledhod not be allowed to have abortion.

      map

      February 6, 2019 at EST pm

    • That’s not far off from what pro-choice winds up being, in practice. It’s just the left can’t even conceive of it in those terms, much less talk about it.

      Jokah Macpherson

      February 6, 2019 at EST pm

  5. Trump has to do this. His first job to get re- elected is to shore up his base. The pro abortion people who vote based on this issue (I know some) will never ever vote for Trump, even if he ignores the issue or comes out pro-choice. it really is all about turning out your base at this point, for both sides.

    Amused Observer

    February 6, 2019 at EST am

    • +1

      Everybody who’s an independent, blue-dog Democrat or moderate Republican swing voter knows that abortion policy hasn’t change in nearly 50 years, and that “late-term abortions” are basically a rounding error. They don’t care, because they recognize that candidate’s blustering about abortion is just symbolic culture war posturing.

      Therefore the only impact it will have is the degree to which it affects the turnout of the base. And Trump talking about abortion is going to rally the evangelical core voters hard. Yes, it might raise turnout among the ardent pro-choicers in the Democrat camp. But probably to a much less degree, since the DNC candidate will be harping on the issue regardless of whether Trump highlights it or not.

      Doug

      February 6, 2019 at EST pm

      • Politics isn’t about policy to most voters. It’s about signaling, picking a side. The symbolic culture war posturing pisses off a lot of people who arent religious. And I don’t mean Richard Dawkins, I’m taking ordinary, middle class white people Trump needs.

        Tanturn

        February 6, 2019 at EST pm

      • “I’m taking ordinary, middle class white people“

        Those are the people who most want to be on the least bad side. Trump’s trying to make the Rs, alleged racism and all, the least bad side.

        Curle

        February 6, 2019 at EST pm

    • “The pro abortion people who vote based on this issue (I know some)”

      You’re correct that the blue hairs can be forgotten. But who else cares about this issue? Plenty of MEN. The pro-choice side never says it, but plenty of men care about this issue not because they care a lot about women’s autonomy or any of that crap, but because they want to shtup the thot they met at a bar and not end up raising a child with her. They don’t have to care solely about this issue. It only needs to push them from “I don’t like Trump but I’ll vote for him because I like the Democrat even less” to “I hate both candidates and won’t be voting.”

      Tanturn

      February 6, 2019 at EST pm

      • And fathers don’t want their teenage daughters to get accidentally pregnant and then forever be assigned to a prole social class single motherhood because she couldn’t get an abortion. Fathers want their daughters to be married before having children.

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        February 6, 2019 at EST pm

      • Nobody “accidentally gets pregnant,” and healthy white babies get adopted quickly.

        No society which kills babies for convenience deserves to exist.

        BaruchK

        February 6, 2019 at EST pm

      • Any father who would encourage his daughter to get an abortion, is an idiot. You only get so many bites at the apple.

        Lowe

        February 6, 2019 at EST pm

      • [Nobody “accidentally gets pregnant,”]

        Totally and utterly false. It happens all the time.

        [and healthy white babies get adopted quickly.]

        True but that’s only because abortion and birth control eviscerated the supply of available infants.

        toomanymice

        February 6, 2019 at EST pm

      • Lots of people make the argument that abortion is a “women’s issue” and we should “just let the women decide”. It’s the go-to for Scott Adams, for instance. But you’re right, it’s a dumb argument. Simple fairness dictates that the man gets a ‘lien’ on any resulting offspring.

        Jokah Macpherson

        February 6, 2019 at EST pm

      • “Nobody “accidentally gets pregnant,” and healthy white babies get adopted quickly.

        No society which kills babies for convenience deserves to exist.”

        Who said the kid would be given up for adoption? If the mother isn’t willing to do so, the father is screwed. Now, there is definitely something very degenerate about this situation. But here’s the thing: PEOPLE AREN’T GONNA PICK UP THAT CROSS. If what you say to people is that their lives should be made less convenient for reasons of morality, that’s dead on arrival. If you want people to get married and have kids the right way, then promote that directly. Convince people that they should actually want to do it, that it isn’t something people need to be forced into. Starting by Katyning the family court system.

        Tanturn

        February 6, 2019 at EST pm

  6. You’re the one with the fallacy. What makes you think us “leave it to the states” types are against the New York policy?

    Vipltd

    February 6, 2019 at EST am

  7. This is such an insane straw man you put up. Nobody in the anti-abortion camp pretends to have utilitarian arguments that you can dunk on. They oppose it because they believe it’s murder.

    bobbybobbob

    February 6, 2019 at EST am

    • Are you anti-abortion? If so, this attitude explains why you are losing.

      Tanturn

      February 6, 2019 at EST pm

  8. I’m glad Trump made The Holocaust a central tenet of his address. I wonder how many times Harry Truman brought up the event in his 1946 SOTU Address? *reads transcript* Zero times.

    Riff Raff Prole

    February 6, 2019 at EST am

  9. Heard on the radio today that SOTU approved by 30% of liberals and 80% of independents. Bodes well for re-election.

    Commercialresidentual

    February 6, 2019 at EST am

  10. Banning abortion and banning third trimester abortions are two different things. The latter is an attempt to pour grit on the slippery slope.

    Half Canadian

    February 6, 2019 at EST am

  11. This is completely OT but I’m full of admiration for that guy who strangled a mountain lion to death.

    Let’s have fun guessing his ethnicity!

    gothamette

    February 6, 2019 at EST pm

    • Grizzly Adams was played by Dan Haggerty, I think it was. That’s a clue.

      Philly

      February 6, 2019 at EST pm

  12. Sure, you can have the economic argument for abortion. That economic argument applies as well to low IQs, non-productive members of society and any other undesirables. Might as well go all in.

    c matt

    February 6, 2019 at EST pm

  13. Maybe, but I think pro-life conservatives are speaking from a position of principle, rather than realpolitik. So they are frequently at a disadvantage to leftists if leftists simply view every policy position as a means to more power (like Gollum hehe).

    Fact Checker

    February 6, 2019 at EST pm

  14. The vast majority of abortions occur in the first trimester. Late term abortions were wanted pregnancies. There are women who find out their baby isn’t healthy, but continue with the pregnancy because their kid is “just going to have to be a fighter.” Then the news gets worse, and they discover the fetus is suffering and “incompatible with life.” Or the pregnancy is a risk to the health of the mother. Abortion should be a non-issue.

    Vince

    February 6, 2019 at EST pm

    • Thank you Vince. Exactly why government should get out of the way and let this be a decision made by the woman and her doctor.

      Lion of the Blogosphere

      February 6, 2019 at EST pm

      • This is just a talking point. Please don’t try and gloss over the fact that there are instances where this WILL be and HAS BEEN abused. Go watch “Gosnell”. See how you feel then. Vast majority of pro-choice viewers are disgusted by what they see.

        My son was 7 weeks early. It was touch and go for a while. I guess, under this law, my wife could have told the doctor that she felt mentally unable to deal with that and had the doctor just snap his neck. Saved us a bundle of trouble.

        …………………………

        Tie the tubes of all those with IQ<83 (not even the Army will accept you below that level). That way you solve most of the problem and you don't license murder.

        Plus, you reverse the current trend of a drop in IQ of about a point a generation.

        gda53

        February 7, 2019 at EST am

      • @gda53

        Sub 83 isn’t enough. You should have tubes tied and vascectomy for everyone who is sub 100.

        SC

        February 9, 2019 at EST am

    • While it’s true late term abortions are comparatively rare, it is not true all began as wanted pregnancies or that the decision to terminate is based on fetal defect. Some women just change their minds, get mad at the father, or procrastinated scheduling the procedure etc.. People in general are stupid and irrational, women even more so, and pregnant women all the more so.

      toomanymice

      February 6, 2019 at EST pm

      • Yeah, they just change their minds and then get an abortion? And insurance covers it? There are a bunch of doctors who will perform it?

        Or, in reality, it’s cost-prohibitive. And one of the cost-drivers is that the facility has an armed guard, bullet-proof glass, and high-paid staff who risk lunatics gunning them down. Another cost-driver is that the facility is out-of-state. Why out of state? Because there are fewer than a half-dozen doctors who will perform it. Why is the pregnancy terminated? Because of birth defects or a threat to the mother’s health and/or reproductive health. But no, she’s going to endure the inquiries of strangers for month after month after month, get fat, only to endanger her own health and pay more money for an abortion. And why? Because single motherhood has become so stigmatized?

        Vince

        February 7, 2019 at EST am

      • Women do indeed seek late term abortions for reasons other than fetal defects. You might be interested in the documentary ‘After Tiller.’

        toomanymice

        February 7, 2019 at EST am

    • The vast majority of fornication occurs without parental consent. Lengthy pre-marital relationships are permitted relationships. There are women and parents who find out the suitor has hidden a character or physical defect, but continue permitting the courtship because “nobody’s perfect.” Then the reveals get worse, and they discover the suitor is unbearable and “incompatible.” Marriage may even be a risk to the health of the daughter. Contraception should be a non-issue.

      CMC

      February 6, 2019 at EST pm

  15. Terrible take. 1. Because of abortion american/western women can be as promiscuous as possible and are screwing around every alpha/ghetto pimp, abortion encourages a slutty lifestyle. 2. Criminality isn’t about abortion, that’s ridiculous, and the same debunked hypothesis popularized by the freakonomics charlatans; criminality was much lower in the 50s and early 60s when abortion was outlawed than in the 80’s and 90s when the country was full of crack and cocaine addicts.

    DJGB

    February 6, 2019 at EST pm

    • “1. Because of abortion american/western women can be as promiscuous as possible and are screwing around every alpha/ghetto pimp, abortion encourages a slutty lifestyle.”

      Birth control is what does that. The kind of woman who uses abortion as her primary form of birth control is an idiot who will keep spreading it even if it’s illegal, with the resulting spawn raised on the government’s dime. With abortion legal women would be marginally less slutty, but the cost of that promiscuity on the rest of society would be heavier.

      “Criminality isn’t about abortion, that’s ridiculous, and the same debunked hypothesis popularized by the freakonomics charlatans;”

      The freakonomics theory is indeed BS, but the basic idea is sound, more thots having kids equals more crime in the next generation.

      “criminality was much lower in the 50s and early 60s when abortion was outlawed than in the 80’s and 90s when the country was full of crack and cocaine addicts”

      This is the kind of lazy thinking that powers the cuckservative movement. It’s like the libtards who believe that if you bus the ghetto kids into the suburbs, they’ll magically get smarter. Banning abortion won’t bring the 1950s back, and it’s not gonna happen in any case. If anything, the anti-abortion movement has enabled and excused promiscuity, as Lion has pointed out:

      https://lionoftheblogosphere.wordpress.com/2013/06/19/why-are-so-many-children-born-out-of-wedlock/

      The anti-abortion movement is a good example of the danger in cryptic politics. At first people saw it as a way to fight back against feminism and degeneracy covertly. Eventually, they were replaced by those who believe in it’s radically egalitarian message, who openly celebrate the dysgenic effect banning abortion would have. If you don’t like X, then attack X directly. #ThotAudit

      Tanturn

      February 6, 2019 at EST pm

      • Why do you people never get as excited about application of the death penalty as killing unborn babies? European historical norm was a 1 or 2 percent execution rate of *total population* for criminality. This is what produced civilization. They didn’t have abortion. Why not vigorously argue for the swift application of the death penalty? I have zero problem with that. If you pull a weapon on somebody, you deserve to die, that simple. I can morally deal with the odd mistake.

        bobbybobbob

        February 7, 2019 at EST am

      • Wow, it has been 5 and a a half years since I wrote that.

        Lion of the Blogosphere

        February 7, 2019 at EST am

  16. LOTB still thinks this is about abortion. When you are talking about “aborting” during labor and immediately after birth, you’re talking about infanticide. Why do you think no Democrat on capital hill who was asked about Northram’s infanticide comments said they heard it? Why do you think the CNN panel shut it down when Stephen Moore brought it up? Running on killing infants is too much, even for much of the Democrats far left base. Most of the American people have reasonable positions on abortion, but killing infants isn’t a reasonable position. Trump did the right thing on mentioning this because most of the country only heard about Northram’s blackface, not his killing newborns comments. For the first time since Roe v Wade, the “abortion” issue can be a political winner for the right. Every Democrat should be asked about the NY and VA bill and Northram’s comments at every opportunity.

    Mike Street Station

    February 7, 2019 at EST am

  17. “As I’ve previously pointed out, the majority of adults in key swing states are pro-choice”

    You’re looking at this as a dichotomy, and that’s not what it is. Almost everybody is technically pro-choice, since very few people advocate completely outlawing abortion, but that’s not the same as advocating no restrictions up to the moment of birth. The Washington Post had a great article about studies on the issue, and determined most of the US thinks abortion should be unrestricted to 20-24 weeks or less, and illegal after that (essentially the Texas/Europe policy). Put another way, almost everybody falls somewhere between “completely illegal” and “illegal after 24 weeks”. Politically, Trump is absolutely right to go after third trimester abortion; the vast majority of the public thinks it should be against the law.

    TWBC

    February 7, 2019 at EST am


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